angelshare Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Actually, that IS consolation. I never thought about the motivation to keep your place in a control state and certainly was oblivious to the marketing/exporting intricacies of the IWH brand. Thanks again for the inside scoop! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boone Posted May 10, 2004 Share Posted May 10, 2004 A little historical background on I.W. Harper. I spent my "Mother's Day" at Bernheim Arboretum, with all three of my of children (young adults) and my husband Pat. We had a nice picnic lunch and went riding bicycles through just a tad bit of the 40 miles available for hiking and cycling... They gave me a brochure. This info was on it... Issac Wolfe Bernheim (1848-1945) established Bernheim in 1929. Mr. Bernheim was a German immigrant who settled in Kentucky. From a humble beginning as a peddler, he became successful distilling bourbon whiskey, which he sold under the I.W. Harper brand. Grateful for his good fortune, he bought and founded Bernheim as a gift to the people of Kentucky. In 1992, the Kentucky legislature designeted Bernheim Kentucky's Officail Arboretum. Ya learn somethin' everyday Bettye Jo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted May 10, 2004 Author Share Posted May 10, 2004 I'm with Bettye Jo. Anyone planning a trip to the Bardstown area should allow some time for a visit to Bernheim Forest. A pic from my last visit there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelshare Posted May 10, 2004 Share Posted May 10, 2004 Bettye Jo - thanks for more fascinating background info on a brand to which I seem to have become pathologically attached. Assuming good weather, maybe Tina and I can make a trip to Bernheim Forest in September. Chuck's pix have piqued my interest, and I'm sure Tina, who is much more the outdoor/gardening enthusiast, would love it. If it's any indication of her enthusiasm, she spent a good hour on Mother's Day pruning lilac bushes, claiming that it was "relaxing."Your post prompted a tangential question. Early on, I mistakenly referred to IW Harper as "Old Harper," which Chuck immediately noted and called to my attention. If hazy memory serves me correctly, "Old Harper" is the name of the whiskey that one of the characters in the film "American Graffiti" tries to buy underage.My question: was "Old Harper" a real brand, or was it distilled from the mind of George Lucas and his co-writers?As you may have perceived from the Fast Eddie Felsen/Hustler posts, I'm fascinated by the intersection of whiskey and movie trivia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boone Posted May 11, 2004 Share Posted May 11, 2004 My question: was "Old Harper" a real brand, or was it distilled from the mind of George Lucas and his co-writers? I don't have a clue ...All I know "for sure" it's not a Heaven Hill label. Maybe somebody on these forums can answer it? Bettye Jo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNbourbon Posted May 12, 2004 Share Posted May 12, 2004 Here's a link to a bit of history about the "Old Harper" whiskey (apparently not bourbon) brand: Old Harper, Bernheim Bros. DistilleryIt was apparently and early-20th Century precursor to the I.W. Harper brand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelshare Posted May 12, 2004 Share Posted May 12, 2004 Wow! Thanks for the link! I was particularly intrigued by the "Old IW Harper" brand name. Obviously, whiskey marketing and branding is complex.So, the "Old Harper" brands appear...well, old (early 20th century). How did it wind up in "American Graffiti," a 1960 period piece actually made in 1971 (or thereabouts)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted May 12, 2004 Author Share Posted May 12, 2004 What's peculiar here is the reference, on the shot glass itself, to Nelson County and the reference in the description to Clear Springs. The Bernheim Brothers facilities were in Paducah, Kentucky, then Louisville, but never in Nelson County. Clear Springs Distillery was the name of the Beam family distillery in Nelson County prior to Prohibition. It's possible the Beams sold something called "Old Harper" completely separate from the Bernheim's I.W. Harper.I don't think this mystery is quite solved yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyc Posted May 12, 2004 Share Posted May 12, 2004 Well look at that Chuck,They credit the Coyte papers as the source of that info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bourbonv Posted May 12, 2004 Share Posted May 12, 2004 Chuck,As you know, Bernheim Bros. started as rectifier in Paducah in the 1870's. They did not own a distillery until the late 1890's after they moved to Louisville. Before they built the distillery they were buying their whiskey in Nelson County and rectifying it into I W Harper and several other brands. They even had a brand they called "Kenessee" which was a marrying of Kentucky Bourbon and Tenessee Whiskey. In the trademark files at the U.D. Archive there are several applications for trademarks for advertising materials for I W Harper. This material uses "I W Harper" and "Old Harper" as interchangable terms for the same product in the advertising. I would say what the item shown is simply a pre-1898 shot glass for I W Harper because of the Nelson County reference.Mike Veach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted May 12, 2004 Author Share Posted May 12, 2004 I wonder how the reference to Clear Springs got in there? Possibly that is the Nelson County distillery the Bernheim Brothers were buying from? Anyway, it certainly makes more sense that the Bernheims used "Old Harper" and "I.W. Harper" interchangeably. There are lots of examples of that, e.g., "John E. Fitzgerald" evolving the other way, into "Old Fitzgerald." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bourbonv Posted May 12, 2004 Share Posted May 12, 2004 Chuck,I think that I W Harper was a "rectified" version of a couple of Nelson County whiskies. I think this is one reason Bernheim fought so hard against the Bottled in Bond Act. He would loose his taste profile if he had to use only one distillery's product to make I W Harper as a Bonded whiskey.Mike Veach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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