What Would You Like to Ask Jim Rutledge . . . ?

[Kyjd75]

Ok, a few of you know that I am a retired circuit judge for the Commonwealth of Kentucky.  I am currently serving as vice-president of an association of former judges of the Kentucky Court of Justice and am heavily involved in planning our annual meeting, which this year is going to be held (at my suggestion) at the Bottle and Bond restaurant at the Bardstown Bourbon Company.  They have an excellent event center upstairs which we are going to use.  Here is the good part, and why I am posting this.

 

Jim Rutledge has agreed to be our main "entertainment" speaker for the morning session.  He has indicated to us that he hopes there will be some good questions presented as he enjoys the question and answer part of any talk he gives.  So, I already have several questions in my mind for Jim, but wondered what some of you would like to ask him if you could.  Post them here and I'll try and get them answered if I can.  The plan is for Jim to hang around after the noon meal as we will have the tasting bar open, as well as tours of the distillery.  So I am thinking I may have some good access to him to talk all things bourbon.  I sure do hope so.

 

So, go ahead and post away!

[smokinjoe]

That sounds cool!  Can I come? I’m not a former judge, but, I did take the LSAT...twice...

Bombed both times, but, I can be entertaining in a court jester sort of way should JR not work out...

Now my question:

 

We have heard of the mutated V yeast that went into some mashed years ago.  Steve”Flahute” gives a  nice synopsis of the “story” behind it below.  Please ask JR to expound on that yeast and if any new info comes out like why/how he thinks it happened, did they try and replicate it, would he have made it the 6th yeast if they could, etc?  

 

 

[Kepler]

I'd ask him if he would  like to come over to my house and join me for a drink of this fine 2013 or 2015 SmBLE that he made. He could tell me how he made it.

[Paddy]

Please ask him how the rye's coming along... 

 

[Mako254]

Why doesn’t bourbon produced today taste like bourbon produced 40 years ago?

we all have our theories but I’d like his insight. 

Whoever can turn out juice that tastes like WT 8/101 from 1986 or OGD BIB from

the ‘80s will have a customer for life. 

[flahute]

1 hour ago, Kepler said:

I'd ask him if he would  like to come over to my house and join me for a drink of this fine 2013 or 2015 SmBLE that he made. He could tell me how he made it.

See the V that wasn't really a V story linked above for why 2013 was so good!

[flahute]

1 hour ago, Paddy said:

Please ask him how the rye's coming along... 

 

It's currently in the barrel somewhere at Castle & Key though not under that name!

[flahute]

Given that he's known for the high rye bourbons at Four Roses and how he always wanted to distill a rye but Kirin wouldn't let him, ask him how he would approach a wheated bourbon since he's said he will distill one at his new distillery. Is there anything particular about fermentation temperature, proof off the still, how he will make the cuts off of the still and barrel entry proof that will be different than how he will approach what he knows best. 

[GaryT]

Similar to Steve's question, but not solely on wheated bourbon - I'd be curious about his thoughts based on experience with proof off the still and barrel entry proof.  Some of us believe that a lower proof off the still and even lower into the barrel leads to a richer/fatter/sweeter bourbon in the end (but if someone asked me to support that belief with facts, I'd scream 'Squirrel!', point one direction, and run in the other).  I'm not sure if at Four Roses (or Seagrams before) they did any experimentation, or if they never bothered because the economics would make it prohibitive.  Given today's market and what folks will pay - I know I'd pay a premium for a higher quality product.  

[Bob_Loblaw]

I have zero idea how far along the new distillery is in terms of distilling/aging its own product.  

 

I'd like to know what different mashbills JR is making and at what age he is most excited to try each mash at.  Basically, does he have an opinion when each product (Bourbon, Rye, Wheater, etc . . .) will hit its "sweet spot"?

[CardsandBourbon]

You know me and I wasn't ever a judge, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night.  Plus I was in charge of the building of the local Justice Center.  So if you needed a third party to . . . I don't know, maybe read the questions to Jim I humbly offer my services.

[Ryan Dee]

14 hours ago, Mako254 said:

Why doesn’t bourbon produced today taste like bourbon produced 40 years ago?

we all have our theories but I’d like his insight. 

Whoever can turn out juice that tastes like WT 8/101 from 1986 or OGD BIB from

the ‘80s will have a customer for life. 

Not to derail this thread, but I think the FDA had a lot to do with that. If I recall they began requiring Distilleries to clean/clear the pipes out after runs (sour mash) thinking it was unhealthy. Atleast I remember that being discussed @ Wild Turkey one time about that.

 

 

Back on track, I'd ask what his secret Bourbon is going to be 10yrs from now, wink wink...LOL

[BottledInBond]

Is he planning on using multiple mashbill and yeast combinations within rye recipe bourbons and single level rock houses at the new distillery similar to what he did at Four Roses? 
 

What was the point of including the “O” and the “S” in each of the codes when those letters stayed the same in all 10 recipes? 
 

Why did regular FRSiB get the leather things around the neck and the private barrels got paper neck wraps? Seemed like the leather is nicer and should have been associated with the more expensive product (private barrels) instead of the cheaper standard bottle.
 

[Phil T]

I seem to remember reading that JR was not really a fan of extra aged bourbon. So, how did some 17 year old OBSV become some of his most revered whiskey? And why was it allowed to age that long?

Edited February 19, 2020 by Phil T

[flahute]

7 hours ago, BottledInBond said:

Is he planning on using multiple mashbill and yeast combinations within rye recipe bourbons and single level rock houses at the new distillery similar to what he did at Four Roses? 
 

What was the point of including the “O” and the “S” in each of the codes when those letters stayed the same in all 10 recipes? 
 

Why did regular FRSiB get the leather things around the neck and the private barrels got paper neck wraps? Seemed like the leather is nicer and should have been associated with the more expensive product (private barrels) instead of the cheaper standard bottle.
 

He is most definitely going to employ single story rickhouses at the new distillery. 

[GaryT]

2 hours ago, flahute said:

He is most definitely going to employ single story rickhouses at the new distillery. 

I would love to know if Jim ever experimented with a more traditional rickhouse at Four Roses (because some amazing barrels have been aged higher than the single story rickhouses).  It seems like the single story approach is limiting in terms of potential brand expressions (the possibilities of those top-rick barrels blended with others to add a little something; etc).  I'm a huge fan of Jim, and don't mean this question from a tone of "Why didn't you" but I'm sure he had given thought to the pros/cons of having at least some multi-story rickhouses - and it would be interesting to hear his thought process on that.

[BottledInBond]

4 hours ago, GaryT said:

I would love to know if Jim ever experimented with a more traditional rickhouse at Four Roses (because some amazing barrels have been aged higher than the single story rickhouses).  It seems like the single story approach is limiting in terms of potential brand expressions (the possibilities of those top-rick barrels blended with others to add a little something; etc).  I'm a huge fan of Jim, and don't mean this question from a tone of "Why didn't you" but I'm sure he had given thought to the pros/cons of having at least some multi-story rickhouses - and it would be interesting to hear his thought process on that.

I thought I had previously heard that he thought they had enough different variables involved already with the 10 recipes at FR, so he didn’t want all the additional variables that multi level rickhouses bring with the wider temperature variances etc.
 

But I certainly could be wrong on that, and yes clearly there has been some amazing whiskey that has come from the 2nd level or higher at some other facilities. 
 

I think some of it has to come down to physical restrictions as well. If a distillery doesn’t have a ton of land to expand on, they may also have no choice except building taller. If they have lots of space, they can do whatever they want I guess. I bet Barton wishes some of there’s had only been single level.....,

[GaryT]

9 hours ago, BottledInBond said:

I think some of it has to come down to physical restrictions as well. If a distillery doesn’t have a ton of land to expand on, they may also have no choice except building taller. If they have lots of space, they can do whatever they want I guess. I bet Barton wishes some of there’s had only been single level.....,

Looks prescient now to say "Ya know . . . them tall rickhouses could be a risk to forces like . . . well, gravity"   FR definitely had a lot of variables at their disposal.  I always assumed (and with that, I see the error in my ways!) that building a 7 story rickhouse would be cheaper than building 7 single story rickhouses.  Guessing that they could have some barrels from higher floors age less time and be suitable for the label formerly known as Yellow.

 

Or maybe I just wish I had higher proof Four Roses aged on a 3rd or 4th story for 9-10 yrs