Would you break a law to acquire good bourbon?

[Dave_in_Canada]

Let's say you wanted to acquire bourbon that was not locally available. Many states and countries have laws against imports, such as complete bans, shipping restrictions, import quotas (cross border duties and limits) etc. However, many states will ship product in unmarked packages. In anonymity....

[Hedmans Brorsa]

I think it should be anyone´s right to obtain stuff that you are unable to get in your home area or country.

[robbyvirus]

How do we know our answers to this poll aren't going straight into some homeland security database?

[kbuzbee]

How do we know our answers to this poll aren't going straight into some homeland security database?

No, this is completely secure and confidential. Just speak right into the keyboard.....

Ken

[Ken Weber]

I realize this is purely for internal use, however, I would like to take the 5th on this (better yet, I would like to taste a 5th!).

Ken

[kbuzbee]

I realize this is purely for internal use, however, I would like to take the 5th on this (better yet, I would like to taste a 5th!).

Ken

Metric, Ken, metric!!! .75l!

[BobA]

I answered "never" to whether I've done so in the past. Attempts to order on the web indicate that although I might be willing, the shippers don't seem to be.

Bob

[cowdery]

This poll is based on a false premise. It is not illegal to order and receive alcohol from out of state, assuming one is of legal age. It is the shipper who might be in violation of a law, but not the shipee.

[gr8erdane]

Living in a very tolerant state, it's a moot point to me. I have ordered from Sam's, Binny's, and Armaghetti's from Chicago, and HiTime from California. Now the few bottles I've been able to actually not get outbid on at eBay might constitute this but as Chuck says, the shipper is the one that would have to face the judge in these cases anyway.

[Dave_in_Canada]

Chuck, the poll isn't limited to cross-state shipping. Cross border is also involved and in those instances, bringing in more than an allowable limit, or not paying taxes and duties would indeed be "breaking the law"

[jbutler]

How do we know our answers to this poll aren't going straight into some homeland security database?

Because you didn't provide your SSN silly! Homeland security only gets tipped off when you apply for a credit card at Home Depot!

And Ken, keyboards are so last week -- speak directly into your optical mouse, it just plain works better.

[kbuzbee]

And Ken, keyboards are so last week -- speak directly into your optical mouse, it just plain works better.

Doah! Well, my Powerbook only has the trackpad (and I cut the mic out of it years ago!). I'd have to get the HSA approved fire wire user monitoring device. Of course I don't have to worry. Chances of them providing a Mac OS driver are nil

Ken

[bluesbassdad]

Dane,

Just curious -- what could you get from Hi-Time that you couldn't get shipped from Chi for less?

Yours truly,

Dave Morefield

[NorCalBoozer]

some shippers add a caveat that you are actually taking posession of the item in said state and they are merely acting as your agent to mail it to you. Sounds like an attempt to remove any liability on their part.

from bevmo invoice:

"All Alcoholic Beverages are sold in CALIFORNIA and TITLE passes to the buyer in CALIFORNIA. We make no representation to the legal rights of anyone to ship or import wines into any state outside California. The buyer is soley responsible for shipment of alcoholic beverage products. By placing an order, you authorize us to act on your behalf to engage a common carrier to deliever your order to you....."

This poll is based on a false premise. It is not illegal to order and receive alcohol from out of state, assuming one is of legal age. It is the shipper who might be in violation of a law, but not the shipee.

[camduncan]

I've only ordered internationally from Binnys once (and that was an expensive exercise....but the Stagg & Sazerac were worth it ) - it was completely above board..I paid the full duty and taxes into Australia.

I've often pushed the limit of Duty Free though. Our limits have recently changed from 1 litre Duty Free to 2.25 litres per person, which is 3 750ml bottles. We got grilled by Australian Customs 2 weeks ago because we'd declared our combined total of 4.5 litres was exceeded by one 6 pack of beer They let us go through after a stern talking too, but the part that really gets me irate is that if you exceed the allowance, and they decide to charge you duty, it is on the whole amount of your alcohol, not just the excess Stinks of profiteering in opinion

[bluesbassdad]

Chuck,

I was thinking someone here had stated that even receiving an illicit shipment of alcohol in Tennessee is a felony. Am I wrong about that?

Tim?

Yours truly,

Dave Morefield

[TNbourbon]

...It is not illegal to order and receive alcohol from out of state, assuming one is of legal age. It is the shipper who might be in violation of a law, but not the shipee.

Even the 'importer' is committing a felony in TN -- you cannot '...import or transport, or cause to be imported or transported, from any other state, territory or country, into this state, any alcoholic beverages...' -- while the carrier, too, is on the hook. (T.C.A.§57-3-102,3 et seq., 57-3-401 et seq.)

[NorCalBoozer]

it would be interesting if there was an easy way to find out when the last time someone was charged and/or convicted of each of these codes or what the overall enforcement was. and if convicted, what was the sentence.

[gr8erdane]

WT Tribute my friend, Sam's and Binny's weren't advertising it at the time. And last year got BMH 21 to bring to Bardstown if I remember right because they had the best price.

[TNbourbon]

it would be interesting if there was an easy way to find out when the last time someone was charged and/or convicted of each of these codes or what the overall enforcement was. and if convicted, what was the sentence.

Well, here is a report (and editorial discussion) of a case from 2002. The issue was taxes, though the felony liquor statute was used, both because it also applied and carried a harsher punishment.

http://hobbsonline.blogspot.com/2002/08/revenooers-for-years-in-new-york-city.html

(Note: Bristol is a city which straddles the TN-VA state line, thereby facilitating such beer/liquor 'importation'.)

[musher]

Since many of the retailers with web sites are willing to ship to Minnesota, I'm guessing its OK, but I also have the feeling that there are a few tax-related issues being ignored.

This also applies to damned near everything else bought over the internet that is taxable in Minnesota. You're supposed to pay a "use tax", which is basically an honor-system sales tax for things bought out-of-state when you live here. You pay any difference between our $0.065 sales tax and the tax you actually paid (yea, right). And I suppose they'll give me a tax refund if the other state's rate was higher, or if I buy clothing in a state that taxes clothing, since it isn't taxable here.

[kbuzbee]

You're right about that, Musher. In these budget crunch times every state is trying to make sure they get what's owed 'em. A bill a couple years ago would have made it mandatory on the vendor to collect the correct tax on any sale to anywhere and forward that tax to the locality to which it was owed. The vendors banned together (with strong input from customers) and presuaded the PTB that such a law would be impossible to enforce in any reasonable manner. It fell apart (for now). One day when all taxation mechanisms are on line it will raise it's head again. On the other had, you should not be being charged sales tax from say, California when you live in MN. So there should be no issue with having higher tax rates rebated. The only online stores I see charging sales tax are those with store fronts in the customer's state. Those businesses are presumed to know the local tax laws and apply them. They still only collect the State sales tax, overlooking the city, county, school district, parish, trash district, water district......... ARGH!!!!!!

We have too many taxing entities.

Ken

[cowdery]

Interesting. Obviously, I don't know every state law and it's certainly possible for a state to make "illegal importing" a crime, although I suspect a lot of these laws, like the cavaet the California retailer is using, have not been tested in the courts. Then you get into issues of capricious enforcement. Ultimately the issue is tax evasion. Otherwise, you get into the Commerce Clause issues the Supreme Court resolved in Granholm v Heald.

[bourbonchef1189]

Since direct shipment is prohibited in Georgia I'm going to have to break the law next itme I'm in Kentucky.

I've Alway's wanted to be a bootlegger anyway

[kbuzbee]

Since direct shipment is prohibited in Georgia I'm going to have to break the law next itme I'm in Kentucky.

I've Alway's wanted to be a bootlegger anyway

We had the pleasure of touring the Scotch Whisky Heritage Centre in Edinburgh this Spring. During the tour they explored the period Scotland went through of moonshiners and bootleggers. It sounded exactly like here. I was kinda surprized. All to avoid the taxes of course.

Ken