Bourbon/Rye Cocktails

[scratchline]

Having amassed a ridiculous supply of bourbon and rye, an extensive library of cocktail books, and a deep bench of liqueurs and mixers, I'm starting this thread to centralize discussion of cocktails built on the bourbon and rye foundation and on the outside chance that a Great American Whiskey Cocktail remains to be discovered.

Up front, I'll suggest that there are five classic whiskey cocktails: the Manhattan, the Old-Fashioned, the Sour, the Sazerac and the Julep. Within these five, the variations are endless when you consider the differences among individual whiskies, vermouths, bitters, etc. With the Julep even the quality of the ice becomes essential to the finished drink. Hence, my purchase of a vintage ice crusher. So...

I'll kick things off with some observations on the Kentucky Bourbon Festival's official drink for 2007: the Fashionable Manhattan. Obviously a hybrid of the Manhattan and the Old-Fashioned, it could just as easily be labeled the Fashionable Manhazerac as the technique of coating the glass with the bitters and citrus oil is stylistically similar to coating the Sazerac glass with absinthe. I had actually first seen this cocktail demonstrated on the At Brown's Bar podcast:

http://www.mixellany.com/podcast/NEWYORK-4.mov

Last night, I mixed a couple of these using 8 yr. Old Fitz 1849 bourbon and Carpano Antica. In one I substituted ruby red grapefruit for the orange. I found the grapefruit variation more subtle and balanced than the orange, although both were sophisticated, complex cocktails. Given the protracted shaking time, 45 sec to 1 min, I also think a higher proof bourbon might be preferable. Something like an Old Grand-Dad Bonded to add more rye to the mix.

Another interesting substitution would be Amer Picon for the bitters. It's distinctive citrus flavor would be a fine addition, I think. BTW, if anyone comes across any Amer Picon, buy it! Buy all of it! If you don't want it, pm me. It is a fantastic ingredient and the dearest, rarest dusty I've been lucky enough to find. Some of you guys near Bakersfield, Ca, help me out.

All-in-all, I give my attempt at the Fashionable Manhattan, a solid B+. A cocktail worthy of the Bourbon Festival and deserving of further exploration.

Tomorrow I'll consider David Embury's Millionaire, but for now I'll just stick with my WT Rye Manhattan.

-Mike

[Gillman]

Excellent thread and delighted to contribute my thoughts - post no. 4000 - for what they are worth.

I think you are right in identifying the 5 main whiskey cocktails. In addition to those you mention, E. Frank Henriques identifies the Presbyterian (whiskey, ginger ale, club soda, ice, a twist). However even in the 1970's he recognised its antiquatedness, so we can safely set it aside I think (although it is an excellent drink especially in the summer - by the way while little in the bluestocking way seems evident in the drink, its name can be explained I think by substituting soda for half the ginger ale normally required).

I do my own variations on all these drinks. Tonight I used rock and rye (largely a citrus-based cordial using some straight whiskey in the base) to fashion (ahem) a sour-type drink. I poured some Jefferson's, added some Canadian whisky to it (why not), then added a dash or two of rock and rye (Leroux'), just enough to sweeten lightly the drink. Bitters went in too (two kinds). Lots of ice. Shake it up good. A delightful summer whiskey refresher.

If you follow the spirits/sweet/bitter/ice formula, with the sweet comprising a fruity addition, you can't go wrong.

The more I get on with whiskey, the more I see the value and logic of the great whiskey cocktails. I'll still take some bourbon or rye neat, but more and more I am turning to a well-made cocktail as the ideal way to consume good whiskey.

Gary

[JeffRenner]

for now I'll just stick with my WT Rye Manhattan.

Let me suggest a variation, and my favorite Manhattan: one ounce (30 ml) each WT rye, WT bourbon, and good vermouth, with two or three dashes Angostura bitters, shaken 45 seconds, served up in a chilled cocktail glass and garnished with a cherry.

Even more elegant and sophisticated, to my taste, than one made with all WT bourbon or rye.

Jeff

[scratchline]

Certainly the Presbyterian deserves mention. I was thinking less in the tall drink direction and more in the classic cocktail vein, but ginger and bourbon/rye are sure two great tastes that taste great together. In looking over recipes, I was very surprised to find Dale DeGroff calling for 7-Up rather than ginger ale for his Presbyterian! And Dave Wondrich calling for blended Scotch!! Which reminds me that I picked up some Ale-8-One in Ohio and need to give that a try.

Jeff, I'll definitely give the WT rye/WT bourbon combination a go. I recently paired Hirsch Canadian Rye and OGD in a Manhattan. I tend to find ryes or rye mash bourbons superior as Italian vermouth already brings enough sweetness to the mix and the spicy kick of rye off-sets it more effectively than most wheaters. A clear example of this was a MM Manhattan that I tried recently that was strikingly one dimensional. I'm not a big MM drinker but someone had given it to me as a gift, and both my buddy and I agreed that it just didn't make it. We added a dash of Old Bardstown, and the drink was completely transformed. I imagine someone will now inform me that OB is a wheater as well. But if it is, it's a very different one from Maker's.

Gary, I've passed up a lot of bottles of Rock and Rye because I thought it was just rye and sugar. Now that I know there's some citrus in there, I'll pick some up.

I'll get to the Millionaire later because I stumbled across something else that I'm really enjoying today. The Cassis:

2 oz. bourbon

1/2 oz dry vermouth

1/4 oz cassis

Stir vigorously. Strain into a chilled glass. Garnish with a lemon twist.

I was using the Old Fitz 1849 and I think something like OGD Bonded might be even better. Even though the drink tends to the sweet side, it's not a schnappsy, syrupy deal. The Vya vermouth I used is very floral and contributes complexity that blends well with the fruit flavor. I have an unopened bottle of a French liqueur called Six that combines different berry and cherry flavors that might be an interesting alternative to the cassis.

I'll keep tinkering with this one. Even though I used to order Manhattans "perfect", I've not been a big fan of bourbon/dry vermouth combinations in the past, but there's something about the cassis that bridges these two nicely.

[cowdery]

There are only three bourbon cocktails that I enjoy with any regularity. They are the manhattan, the sour, and bourbon & ginger.

I'm big on easy and tasty (a morning team in Detroit, if memory serves), so there's nothing fancy here.

My manhattans are pretty standard. I enjoy them shaken or on the rocks about equally well. Yes, I said "shaken." Experts say drinks that are mostly liquor, such as the manhattan should be stirred, not shaken. I like them shaken.

My manhattan is roughly 4 parts whiskey to one part vermouth, with a couple dashes of bitters. I like to garnish with a cherry, just as my mom and dad did. When served up I like a chilled glass. The whiskey tends to be a high-rye bourbon or straight rye; Rittenhouse, Grand-Dad, VOB. I tend to use a BIB. I've also been known to use American Blended Whiskey, as they often do in the Northeast, or even Canadian whiskey, as they often do in the Midwest.

My sour is more like a bourbon margarita. It's a generous pour of bourbon or rye, a little triple sec, fill with ice, top with sweet and sour mix. (I prefer Mr. & Mrs. T.) Of the three, this is the best one for using up an unpleasant whiskey less unpleasantly.

My bourbon & ginger probably is equal parts whiskey and soda, or maybe skewed slightly in the soda's favor. I prefer Ale 8 One, which is made in Winchester, Kentucky, and seems to have a natural affinity for the state's whiskey, as seems only right. As with the manhattan, I like something very flavorful such as Rittenhouse Rye, Old Grand-Dad, Bulleit, or Very Old Barton, but really any good whiskey will do.

Most of the time I drink my whiskey neat, but when I feel like a whiskey cocktail I usually have one of those three.

[TBoner]

I'm a Sazerac fan, particularly using half whiskey and half brandy. My current favorite is using half Laird's bonded apple brandy (comes across more like whiskey) and half OGD BIB. I use the standard method of rinsing my Old-Fashioned glass with pastis (I like Herbsaint, since it's from N.O.), then adding my chilled whiskey and bitters. I use Peychaud's, of course, and garnish with a lemon twist, but I find a dash of Fee Bros. lemon bitters improves the nose, lengthens the finish, and adds a nice bit of complexity.

I've lately been playing with the Redhook, a Manhattan variation with Punt e Mes instead of vermouth and the addition of 1/4-1/2 oz. of maraschino liqueur (I go for the low end, as this stuff is sweet and potent in flavor). A terrific drink. I also like a Manhattan with 1/4-1/2 oz. of curacao (or my homemade tangelo liqueur) added. The drink is sweeter, but the citrus is a great match for the whiskey and the sweet vermouth.

Going a step farther in variations on the Manhattan, I've used 1/2 oz. of Campari in place of 1/2 oz. of sweet vermouth, generally omitting the bitters when I do this. The drink can't even really be called a manhattan at this point, I guess, but it's good. The recipe usually looks like this:

2 oz. whiskey

1/2 oz. sweet vermouth

1/2 oz. Campari

orange twist for garnish

I generally like to flame any citrus twist for a whiskey cocktail. I think the caramelized orange oils are a natural flavor match for the caramel and char in a good straight whiskey.

Most of my whiskey cocktails are done with high-rye bourbons or straight ryes. I do love a wheater in a julep, though, and I think a good wheater can make a good, though very different, Old-Fashioned.

[CrispyCritter]

The Red Hook is a definite favorite of mine. Another one that I really like, which in a way fuses the Manhattan and the Sazerac, is the Cocktail a la Louisane:

3/4 oz. rye (I tend to use Rittenhouse BIB, WT, or Baby Saz)

3/4 oz. Bénédictine

3/4 oz. sweet vermouth

3 dashes Peychaud's Bitters

3 dashes pastis or absinthe

Stir well with cracked ice, strain into a chilled cocktail glass, garnish with a cherry.

[ILLfarmboy]

When it comes to cocktails I'm a late bloomer. I've only been drinking Manhattans for a few short years and Old-fashioneds since earlier this spring. I have done a little experimenting with adding Triple Sec in place of some of the sugar. I like that. My recipe usually goes as follows: 2 oz. whiskey (usually rye), one teaspoon water, one half teaspoon Triple Sec and one half or one quarter teaspoon sugar one slightly molested (not fully muddled) orange slice and one intact maraschino cherry.

[TBoner]

On the Spirits and Cocktails forum over at eGullet, I've been reading a good bit about the Vieux Carre, a classic cocktail that's enjoying a bit of a revival. I finally got around to making some this week, and I'm really enjoying the drink. It's sort of a cross between a Sazerac and a Manhattan:

1 oz. rye/bourbon

1 oz. cognac

1 oz. sweet vermouth

1 tsp. Benedictine liqueur

2 dashes Peychaud's

2 dashes Angostura

Benedictine is an herbal liqueur with a smoky character and some nicely spicy notes. The herbaceousness doesn't approach Chartreuse levels. It's a truly beautiful liqueur, and it pushes this cocktail to great heights. This is one of very few cocktails (as opposed to neat spirits) I'd consider as a cigar accompaniment.

[cowdery]

Here's a recipe that I haven't tried yet, but it looks kind of interesting.

Jim Beam Bourbon Slush

• 2 cups Jim Beam® Bourbon

• large can frozen orange juice

• large can frozen lemonade

• 1-1/2 cups sugar

• 4 tea bags

• 8 cups water

Take some of the heat out of summer with this refresher. Make a day ahead of time. Boil 2 cups of the water and make tea. Mix tea with all other ingredients and freeze. To serve, scoop into a glass and add a small amount of ginger ale or lemon-lime soda to make slushy. Makes 10–12 servings.

[TBoner]

I just finished a variation of the aforementioned Vieux Carre that was very nice, and would make a great Thanksgiving cocktail:

3/4 oz. Laird's bonded apple brandy

3/4 oz. Old Forester BIB (1980s version: orange, cherry, flowers, and cinnamon)

3/4 oz. Cinzano sweet vermouth

1 tsp. Cherry Marnier (not always available: any good cherry flavored brandy liqueur will work)

2 dashes Peychaud's

2 dashes homemade bitters (similar to Fee Bros. Aromatic - lots of cardamom and cinnamon)

Stir with ice and strain. Flame an orange peel over the glass.

I really dig the interaction of fruitiness here: apple, orange and cherry (from the vermouth, the whiskey, and the Marnier) are great together. Then throw in the pie spice from the bitters and whiskey. Superb.

[scratchline]

Need to catch up on my cocktail posting. After a week of straight bourbon appreciation thanks to TNBourbon and the Mellow Moments Club, I'm back in NYC and putting my Weber kettle rotisserie to the test. So it only seems reasonable to get back into the cocktail swing as I tend the fire.

Last night I tried out the Maple Leaf. Really just a sour sweetened with maple syrup:

1 1/2 oz bourbon (Old Bardstown Bonded)

1/2 oz lemon juice

1/2 oz maple syrup

Shake. Strain.

Good but TOO sweet. Definitely need to pull back on the syrup or ramp up the lemon. Also rye might give this a little more punch. All-in-all not bad, but.... I'm very intrigued by the idea of maple syrup as a sweetener but this isn't it.

Then I tried out TBoner's first Vieux Carre recipe. Very nice. Complex as you might imagine with the cognac and bourbon and vermouth. My girlfriend who favors Sidecars was very impressed. This is definitely one to return to. Thanks, TBoner!

Today I started with a modified Manhattan:

2 oz bourbon (WT 12)

1/2 oz Amer Picon (the original 78 proof)

2 dashes Fees orange bitters

2 dashes Bitter Truth bitters

Stir madly.

This is a tremendous cocktail as you might expect from what is essentially a Manhattan. The Amer Picon is never to be passed up. If you see a bottle of this, buy it. I will miss mine when it's gone. Some folks would add syrup to this but that would be a mistake. Also, I recommend that any cocktail afficionados go to the trouble to contact Stephan and get some of the Bitter Truth bitters. Worth the trouble, and he is a guy you want to support. BTW, if anyone has any word on the Angostura orange bitters availability, I'd appreciate the info.

Finally I'm on to Chuck's bourbon and ginger. As per his recommendation the Ale 8 One is great in this one. I may add a squeeze of lemon or lime to the next one, but I have no complaints here.

But, Chuck, you must eschew the T sour mix! A squeeze of lemon or lime and some demerara syrup and you'll take your sour to another realm. Given the sophistication of your palate, you need to go there. It's really not much extra effort.

[CrispyCritter]

I'm going to have to see if I can find a bookstore that stocks Imbibe! magazine. Apparently, the current issue has a recipe for an Amer Picon substitute that involves Amaro Ramazzotti, Stirrings Blood Orange Bitters, and a homemade orange peel tincture.

[TNbourbon]

Taking off on Lynchburg Lemonade tonight, but with almost none of the correct ingredients in-house, so I guess I have the Columbia Convolution instead. Anyway, it's pretty good.

I just mixed it in situ in a tall, 16-oz. Kahlua cocktail glass:

3-1/2 oz. pineapple juice

3-1/2 oz. sweet-and-sour (Daily's)

4 oz. Old Overholt 80-proof rye (late-'90s bottle)

topped up the glass with Club soda

garnished with two maraschino cherries

stirred over three ice cubes

Here's a collection of whiskey/whisky cocktails:

http://www.whiskymag.com/cocktails/

Postscript: Okay, just got to the bottom of the glass, and those cherries were excellent! I'm ordering a second round (just wish the drinker was a better tipper).

[scratchline]

Nice link, Tim. That'll keep me busy for a while.

Decided to use some British ginger beer syrup to sweeten a lime sour tonight:

1/2 oz lime juice

1/4+ oz ginger beer syrup

1 1/2 oz bourbon (4 Roses Small Batch)

Shake. Strain.

Very good. But I'm going to try another one with a more assertive, higher proof whiskey. The ginger/lime combination is a little overpowering. Also just a touch of demerara syrup to take some of the edge off the lime. Stay tuned.

-Mike

Round 2. Added 1 teaspoon of demerara syrup to the mix and switched over to Old Bardstown Bonded. This cocktail is still pretty edgy. The ginger syrup has a sharpness that is very difficult to tame. It's not unpleasant but definitely not as gentle as the traditional bourbon and ginger ale. It's going to be a long hot summer in NYC so further experiments will be made.

[TNbourbon]

...But I'm going to try another one with a more assertive, higher proof whiskey. The ginger/lime combination is a little overpowering...

I might also suggest a straight rye, whether high-proof or not -- that is exactly what I was thinking when I opted for the Overholt tonight against the pineapple/sweet-and-sour. When I tried barrel-proof Old Potrero in the second 'round', I found I prefered the 80-proof OO rye.

[scratchline]

Julep night tonight. There's obviously a lot of variation in recipes for this one, but I have no complaints with what I did this evening:

1 big sprig of mint leaves (10-12)

Generous 1/2 teaspoon demerara syrup

2 oz bourbon (WT 12)

Muddle the mint and syrup together in an Old-Fashioned glass taking care not to overdo it and turn the whole thing too bitter. Pack the glass with crushed ice. Pour the bourbon over. Stir long and well. Repack with ice. Stir til a healthy frost is on the glass. Repack with ice. Garnish with a big sprig of mint. Serve outside in the summer heat.

The frosty glass is a key element to this cocktail. As is the hot day. I often use wheaters for juleps. Weller 107 is a good one, but it's hard to ruin WT 12. Jenny will be back with more ice soon and I'll try a barrel strength whiskey. You want something that can stand up to the ice and the heat and keep the flavor coming.

David Embury recommends bitters and as I don't remember ever having a julep with bitters, I'll probably throw that into the mix as well.

Sippin' a fine mint julep on a little terrace in a hot Manhattan evening a 1/2 block from Central Park can almost convert your studio apartment into a manse. Since I'm temporarily the Squire of the Manor tonight, I'll be generous and give myself an A on this one.

-Mike

[JDutton]

I suppose this would be considered a variation on a julep:

Snowshoe:

1 - 2 parts WT 101 to taste

1 part DeKuyper Peppermint Schnapps

Serve over ice.

Apparently this originated as a shooter with equal parts of WT and PS.

Jeff

[TBoner]

scratchline,

Glad you enjoyed the Vieux Carre. It continues to be a favorite for me. The other night, I swapped out the cognac for Cuervo 1800 Anejo. It was very good. Not perhaps on par with the original recipe, but a nice change of pace.

I've also been making a drink called the Slope recently. This is a drink from the Flatiron Lounge that's a variation on the Red Hook (itself a variation of the Manhattan). I learned about the drink through eGullet, had the ingredients on hand, and away I went. At any rate, the version I originally made was:

2 oz. rye

1/2 oz. Apry (apricot flavored brandy liqueur)

1/2 oz. Punt e Mes

It was good, but sweet, as Apry is very sweet and potent.

A few days after I made this, however, over on eGullet forums, a bartender from Flatiron posted that the version they make is:

2 1/2 oz. rye (Rittenhouse was specified)

3/4 oz. Punt e Mes

1/4 oz. Apry

1 dash Angostura

I made one like this but with WT Rye, since I don't have any Rittenhouse open. Tremendous. The Apry is sweet enough to counter the Punt e Mes, and the drink is very well-balanced and spicy. I also tried one with my homemade bitters, which was equally good but different. Recommended.

[scratchline]

Hey, Tim. I'd been following that eGullet thread and actually made a Slope the other night with the 2,1/2,1/2 proportions substituting Grande Passion, Grand Marnier's passionfruit liqueur, for the Apry. Since then, I've located my bottle of Apry and was planning to give the other recipe a try. I'll definitely do it.

-Mike

[TBoner]

I'm intrigued by the passionfruit idea. How was it?

I hope to find some Ale8One sometime, as I've pretty much run through all the ginger ales and ginger beers I can get here. I have a couple I really like, but after hearing about it from so many different people, Ale8One has achieved mythical status in my mind.

As a takeoff on the Vieux Carre, I made the following recently. I'll be tweaking ratios, but it was interesting, and a good start at something very nice.

1 oz. Saz Jr.

1 oz. Zwack barack palinka (dry apricot brandy)

1 oz. Cinzano Bianco vermouth (lots of vanilla in this)

1 tsp. maraschino liqueur

2 dashes homemade bitters

1 dash peach bitters

The barack palinka is very potently flavored, so I think WT rye would balance it better. The vanilla, apricot, and spice of the three principal ingredients are great together, with the maraschino liqueur melding the sweetness of the whiskey and the "funk" of the eau-de-vie together nicely. I'll play with the choice of whiskey, and may wind up changing proportions completely, but initially I just wanted to do something that played on the Vieux Carre idea. I'll post more when I get this just right, but there's something there.

[TBoner]

I'm finishing off a Ward 8 right now. I've seen a variety of recipes floating around, but they're all similar, and all close to what I used:

2 oz. rye

1/2 oz. orange juice

1/2 oz. lemon juice

1 tsp. grenadine

Shaken with ice and strained into a chilled cocktail glass. Garnished with flamed orange and lemon twists.

In a way this is just a variation on the whiskey sour, but it's got more going on than that. The interplay of two different citrus juices plus the backdrop of grenadine (I used a homemade version: pomegranate juice and sugar) does great things for the whiskey, drawing out both fruit and spice. I used 2 oz. rye because I was using Overholt. Many recipes call for just 1.5 oz., and I think that might work with a more assertive rye like WT Rye. Regardless, I think this one calls for rye, and not bourbon, for sure.

BTW, after a sip, I couldn't resist adding a couple of drops of Fee Bros. orange bitters. Yowza. This is a terrific way to enjoy whiskey in the heat of summer.

[smokinjoe]

I'm intrigued by the passionfruit idea. How was it?

I hope to find some Ale8One sometime, as I've pretty much run through all the ginger ales and ginger beers I can get here. I have a couple I really like, but after hearing about it from so many different people, Ale8One has achieved mythical status in my mind.

As a takeoff on the Vieux Carre, I made the following recently. I'll be tweaking ratios, but it was interesting, and a good start at something very nice.

1 oz. Saz Jr.

1 oz. Zwack barack palinka (dry apricot brandy)

1 oz. Cinzano Bianco vermouth (lots of vanilla in this)

1 tsp. maraschino liqueur

2 dashes homemade bitters

1 dash peach bitters

The barack palinka is very potently flavored, so I think WT rye would balance it better. The vanilla, apricot, and spice of the three principal ingredients are great together, with the maraschino liqueur melding the sweetness of the whiskey and the "funk" of the eau-de-vie together nicely. I'll play with the choice of whiskey, and may wind up changing proportions completely, but initially I just wanted to do something that played on the Vieux Carre idea. I'll post more when I get this just right, but there's something there.

T, you can go to www.ale-8-1.com and order from their company store. They'll ship to you.

JOE

[smokinjoe]

Ale-8-One Ginger Ale has the following Summer Frozen Cocktail on their website:

A Late Freeze

Pour six (6) 12oz bottles of Ale-8-One into a saucepan. Boil until reduced by half. (About 15-20 minutes) Cool, and then add one ounce of Kentucky bourbon for every bottle of Ale-8-One. *(It took me a minute, but I figure that's 6oz of bourbon...) Freeze until slushy and then mix in blender. Makes 4, 8oz servings.

I'm down to my last 4 bottles of Ale-8-One, but I think I'll give this a try. Particularly since it's going back over 100 degrees here today.

Cheers!

JOE

[cowdery]

One need not hanker for Ale-8-One. They'll gladly ship you some, fresh from the factory, for a very reasonable price. Click here.