Prominence of Knob Creek

[cowdery]

I tend to keep an eye on any press releases and press reports about the parent companies of the various bourbon brands. I have noticed for sometime now that Jim Beam parent Fortune Brands describes its wine and spirits component thusly: "Major spirits and wine brands sold by units of Jim Beam Brands Worldwide, Inc. include Jim Beam and Knob Creek bourbons, DeKuyper cordials, The Dalmore single malt Scotch, Vox vodka and Geyser Peak and Canyon Road wines."

What's interesting about this is that Knob Creek shares the bourbon stage with Jim Beam itself, to the exclusion of all of the other bourbon brands Beam sells. Why? It certainly isn't their #2 best seller. Old Grand-Dad probably is secure in that position. It may be the second-most profitable. I suspect the other reason, and perhaps the most important one, is that Knob Creek has achieved a recognition and cachet out of proportion to its sales. Personally, I'm glad to see it. When a company like Fortune Brands, at the corporate level, puts a brand like Knob Creek on its list of star corporate assets, that's good for our side, i.e., good for people who want more premium bourbon at an affordable price. It's a kind of validation. Other makers, take note.

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://cowdery.home.netcom.com>--Chuck Cowdery</A>

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Bleeeeeeeee! The trend towards better bourbon is indeed heartening Chuck. I'm sure that Jerry Dalton (he's Jim Beam's Master Distiller for those that don't know) told me last year that Knob Creek sales were better than 100,000 cases. Do you have a more accurate figure? That's some pretty good sales for a 'small batch' bourbon.

Linn Spencer

Have Shotglass. Will Travel.

[texascarl]

A few weeks ago I stopped in to meet a couple of old buddies at a local pub. They're both beer drinkers, but I bought us all a glass of Knob Creek and we were sitting there discussing the taste when the local distributors rep stopped in the bar. He saw the Knob Creek bottle out, the 3 of us drinking bourbon, swirling it around, clinking ice and talking about bourbon, so he asked the bar-tender if we'd all ordered KC. When he found out we all had a glass of KC, he bought another round for all of us. "Just keep drinking that Knob Creek" he said.

So I will. I'm doing my part.

[bobbyc]

Damn , you talked me into it , I think I'll go pour one now.To TexasCarl , KnobCreek And all the rest . Smooth Whiskey Thanks man!

Bobby Cox

[kitzg]

Knob Creek has what we folks in Marketing call brand equity. First, the name itself is recognizable by many -- even those who don't regularly drink it. Second, it stands for quality.

KC has truly become a brand of distinction for Fortune Brands.

Thanks for bringing it up, Chuck.

Greg Kitzmiller

[Guest **DONOTDELETE**]

Check this out -> The latest edition of the Kentucky Bourbon Circle newsleter has just come out and on page three they proclaim "Knob Creek has emerged as the No. 1 - selling ultra-premium bourbon in the world".

There is little wonder why: 1) The bourbon tastes great, 2) It's Beam Whiskey, and lastly number three a tremendous amount of money has been spent promoating Beam's bevy of 'small batch bourbons'.

But always remember this *** it was good whiskey first,*** and great whihskey after the marketers got hold of it.

I like Beam whiskey. Always have. I do love Knob Creek. In my lifetime it is the very best bourbon Beam has ever offered for sale.

Now if only I could get it at $19.99 like TexasCarl can.

Mmmm. Mmmm. Mmmm. Did I hear someone say Bleee!?

Linn Spencer

Have Shotglass. Will Travel.

[boone]

Tom will be up in a little bit....I bet you will hear him say it! ;-)

Bettye Jo

[MurphyDawg]

BLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

uhm, now all I need is a bottle of Knob Creek . . . . . . .

TomC

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Linn on Tue Jun 18 13:00:45 2002 (server time).</FONT></P>

[cowdery]

Okay, so Knob Creek is the breakout hit, but why? Linn has said why he likes it, but my question is a little different. Until recently, Beam advertised the Small Batch bourbons equally, so why did Knob Creek become the breakout hit instead of Booker's, Baker's or Basil Hayden (okay, never mind Basil Hayden. It just sucks.)?

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://cowdery.home.netcom.com>--Chuck Cowdery</A>

[bourbonmed]

Linn,

What's interesting about Knob Creek is that it has achieved "super premium" status without being priced at premium prices like Distillers Masterpiece, Hirsch, Van Winkle, Jefferson's, RHF or Hancock.

Just wait till the marketing boys figure out they can sell a Limited Edition Knob Creek--using slightly different age or proof. Betcha they are already working on a Gold Edition package.

Omar

[bourbonmed]

Chuck,

It may be a combination of factors. Bakers and Bookers are heavier, higher proofed and more expensive ($38-$52). Knob Creek, priced in low $20s, also features the most attractive packaging of the entire small batch line. Personally, I prefer the taste of Bakers -- but it's usually $40-42 in Miami.

You'd think JB would borrow a marketing page from Knob Creek and price the rest of the small batchers the same. But maybe doing so would cannibalize Knob Creek sales.

Omar

[MurphyDawg]

I don't know if it is like this everywhere, but in Central Ohio the only Beam small batch you can get is Knob Creek. . . And I have checked State Stores in 4 counties. Being the only member of their "Small batch line" that widely savailable around here HAS to help sales. The Economics of it (the fact that it is realitively cheap) cant hurt either.

TomC

[tdelling]

>But always remember this *** it was good whiskey first,*** and great whihskey

>after the marketers got hold of it.

I agree wholeheartedly. The phenomenon is just like movies and music... it takes

a good product plus good marketing to be a success. Marketers can bombard

the public with all kinds of advertizing, posturing, branding, image making, etc.,

but if the product is mediocre, then it will never be a real success.

Tim

[ratcheer]

I have only tried two of the four. Booker's is a bit too expensive and I have avoided Basil Hayden's based on many comments in these forums.

I don't much care for Baker's. It is too dry and "thin" tasting for me to enjoy. I still have a half bottle of it and I've been intending to re-sample it, this week. I haven't been able to convince myself to pour it, yet. Maybe tomorrow.

On the other hand, Knob Creek is still in my top five. It tastes like what bourbon (good bourbon) should taste like. It is rich, the age and the wood come through just right, and it fits my sweeter taste preference.

I am not surprised that KC is winning out. I have no knowledge of the facts, but I also wouldn't be surprised if it outsells the other three, combined.

Tim

[ratcheer]

Man, that is odd. I have to pay $32 for Knob Creek, but Baker's is just $32.25!

Tim

[MurphyDawg]

hey man,

be a pal and just delete the entry anyway, i was just screwin' around, didn't mean to bohter no one

i dont know how my settings changed, it never did that before

TomC

[Bob]

Chuck,

Knob Creek is the only one of the four that I've purchased, and that was completely due to the cost differences amongst the Small Batch Bourbons. Future purchases would keep me with KC because of it's great taste and great price!

Bob

[Kauf]

Linn,

At Sam's Club, here in Waukesha, a .75L of Knob Creek was $16.98. That price was too good to pass up, I picked up a bottle today.

Bob Kaufman

[bobbyc]

What a great price that should be getting close to cost wouldn't you think, lets hope not maybe it will go down some more.

Bobby Cox

[Blackkeno]

What about JD?

[Blackkeno]

This might sound like heresy, but I always have a bottle of Booker's on hand, but never have KC. Booker's to me is more distictive--straight from the cask bourbon. How can someone not love that? I'm very fond of KC, so why don't I have it too? Because, so many times I'm at a bar and they don't have any interesting /hard to find bourbons--but they have KC. "I'll have Knob Creek!" So the night is not a disappointment...

[tdelling]

>What about JD?

I'd thought about that a little as I was making my post.

JD would never make it as a new product today. They're

like Microsoft... they got in early, they got market share,

and among people who don't know any better (the majority),

they became THE brand name in the industry.

And the way I see it, JD is better than the competition... the

competition being Canadian Club, Cutty Sark, etc. I'll have

a Jack and Coke long before I drink a cheap Canadian, or

anything like Clan MacGregor.

Tim

[cowdery]

Jack Daniel's always had an original image. It doesn't seem like that today because so many brands have copied it after the fact. Jack was in a square bottle when everyone else was round. Jack bore a man's name when everyone else was using names like "Sunny Brook" and "Belle of Nelson." Jack had a simple black-and-white label when everyone else was using gaudy colors. Jack was willing to be down home when everybody else was trying to be downtown. Also, after the war (WWII) when fully aged bourbon was scarce, Jack refused to water down its brand as many others did (spinning off the brand name into blends and other products that could be made quickly) and instead turned the scarcity into a plus.

Yes, Jack has become ordinary to us because it is now a mainstream brand, but back then it was considered a premium product. All of today's "better" bourbons owe a debt to Jack Daniel's, Wild Turkey and Maker's Mark for making the concept of "premium" bourbon possible.

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://cowdery.home.netcom.com>--Chuck Cowdery</A>

[Winslow]

It's also interesting to note that the History Channel's "Hands on History" profiled the production of Bourbon at the Jim Beam Distillery. The program ended with the bottling of Knob Kreek (the spark of my interest). Beam could have chosen any of its brands to finish with and picked this one.

At my local supermarket Knob Creek is the only small batch Bourbon to be found. In fact, I bought their last bottle this week. The price: $29.95. I hope to find it cheaper on my upcoming "Indiana Run". Also interesting is that on another occasion that I bought a bottle at this store, the girl at the liquor counter said: "What is that stuff? I've seen it up there but no one buys it." (It was, indeed, dusty!) After I explained things to her she said that she had always assumed, because of the name, that it was some kind of cheapo booze nobody drank! That the name "Knob Creek" made her think of "Boones Farm"!

[ratcheer]

Hmmm. I poured my Baker's, last night, and it was...

good!

That was about my sixth tasting of it and it was the first time I really enjoyed it. I suppose my taste is changing. This time, it seemed full bodied and quite a bit sweeter than I remembered.

Maybe I'm losing touch with reality.

Tim