View Full Version : Is it Bourbon

05-13-2005, 06:06
Check out this article

"Buffalo Trace likewise has two ryes in their portfolio. Super-premium Sazerac Kentucky Rye is a limited production, 18-year old straight whiskey and a member of their Antique Bourbon Collection. In 2002 the distillery introduced George T. Stagg, a vivacious 15-year-old rye whiskey bottled at barrel strength (137.6 proof), undiluted and unfiltered."

RYE: THE NEXT HOT WHISKEY (http://www.beveragenet.net/sw/2004/0409/0409brb1.asp)

05-13-2005, 06:13
Its nice to see that the industry "experts" are on top of things. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/bs.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

05-13-2005, 12:22
I find this one to be the most puzzling among several questionable statements:

Buffalo Trace produces whiskey from five core recipes. Some have higher proportions of rye, others wheat, while still others feature mash bills with neither [emphasis mine].

Ken Weber, can you help me out here?


Of course, if I ever make it to Bardstown, I'll be sure to go see

[Handcrafted at] the McLain & Kyne Distillery in Bardstown, KY, [Jefferson's Reserve . . . ]

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

05-13-2005, 19:33
In 2002 the distillery introduced George T. Stagg, a vivacious 15-year-old rye whiskey bottled at barrel strength (137.6 proof), undiluted and unfiltered."

Does anyone besides me remember the post I made with that one and the field day that followed?
http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/duel.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif

05-14-2005, 12:52

No, I don't recall your earlier post. No surprise there -- my memory is notoriously unreliable.

However, what does surprise me is that a search on "+vivacious +rye" turns up only two posts, both in the current thread. I wonder what I'm doing wrong in the SEARCH function.

I'm in the mood to review an old field day thread right now. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

05-14-2005, 20:05
A Reasonable Facsimile (http://www.straightbourbon.comhttp://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/22315/an/0/page/2#22315)

Not my best piece of work but it sure gave me a chuckle remembering it.I would vote for Cliffs post as an all time classic! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/woohoo.gif

I really think my Bill Samuels Jr Rocket Man post was my all time high/low

At any rate I wasn't feeling too charitable either day, good thing I only have those days twice in 3 years! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif

05-15-2005, 06:29
Bobby, that link results in "Access denied".


05-15-2005, 09:29
It is in a deleted bin, sorry about that. It is truely forgetable.

05-15-2005, 10:15
So you guys get to keep all the R-Rated (even X-Rated http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif when a certain Virginian was around), deleted posts in a private cache for your exclusive entertainment, eh?

That's cool. Y'all deserve something for ensuring that this is truly the happiest place on earth (or at least in cyberspace).

Also, I must admit I'm relieved to learn that access is denied to all the rank and file members, not just me. (We paranoids can have real enemies as well as imaginary ones, don't you know. http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif )

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

05-15-2005, 12:44
Oh, we have a special file on you Dave http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/skep.gif http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/70358-devil.gif

05-15-2005, 13:10
Just cause your paranoid, doen't mean people aren't out to get ya! http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

05-15-2005, 15:51
Entirely right Dale, but then again you never can tell just WHO is watching...

BTW Dave, stop peeking out the window, set down the bottle that's almost empty and for goodness sakes put some club soda on that stain on your shirt before it sets in.....


05-15-2005, 20:48

Ken Weber
05-16-2005, 07:15
Stagg is a rye recipe bourbon. The 5 recipes that I can reveal at this time include BT #1 and BT #2, both rye recipe boubons (Buffalo Trace and Stagg are #1 and Blanton's and Elmer T. Lee are #2); a straight rye whiskey (Sazerac Rye and a new one we will introduce in September); wheat recipe bourbon, and 100% organic corn. We currently have at least three other recipes aging and will be ready to taste in about 2 more years.


05-16-2005, 07:54
Recently I made a blend of Blanton's Original, Blanton's Gold, Buffalo Trace and Elmer Lee. Since these are all rye recipe bourbons made and aged in the same distillery, I feel this is effectively just another approach to sampling Trace whiskey. I added a bit of this one and a bit of that until the taste was just right. It is very soft, very full in taste, with nutmeg and cinnamon hints which come from the Trace and Elmer Lee. I have two versions, a second one is not quite so good because the Gold in it had a strong woody (not charred wood) taste, reminiscent of certain Island rums in fact (maybe these are congener odors) but it makes a great Manhattan!


05-16-2005, 11:54

Stagg is a rye recipe bourbon.

So I understand, thanks to this forum. However, the author failed to note the distinction between that formulation and "rye whiskey". The error was cemented, IMO, by the reference to George T. Stagg as "rye whiskey" in the same paragraph where Sazerac 18 y/o was correctly so identified.

That same paragraph might also lead the reader to believe that a "straight whiskey" and a "rye whiskey" are mutually exclusive.

If it were my business to create and promote product identity for bourbon and rye in general, or Buffalo Trace bottlings in particular, I'd be concerned that Adams Beverage Group, whoever they are, might be undermining my efforts.

. . . and 100% organic corn.

Now there's something I didn't know and would not have guessed. Under what label does Buffalo Trace market 100% corn whiskey? Is it available in areas where I can buy it? (AZ, CA and TX, for example.)

I will be looking for the press release that announces the September release of your new rye bottling.

Yours truly,
Dave Morefield

05-16-2005, 12:05
. . . and 100% organic corn.

The Rain vodka from BT is made from 100% organic corn.

05-18-2005, 05:39
I can definitely taste the family resemblance in the BT and Stagg. In fact, at our tour of BT a couple of years ago, most in our group preferred the barrel-proof BT to either the ETL or the Blantons. That's because we were tasting adolecent Stagg http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/images/graemlins/lol.gif Ken, where is most of the BT aged in relation to where you're finding the Stagg barrels? I'm guessing they're in close proximity.

06-04-2005, 17:52
So do you care to reveal any more about the new rye you're planning to introduce in September? Age? Proof? Distribution? Profile? I hope this reflects that you have a lot of rye aging. I would love to have a "baby Saz" with greater availability. But on the other hand, I had to really search to get a single bottle of Saz and would definitely have mixed feelings if availability of something younger beginning in Sept. meant that 8-10 years from now, the 18 yr. is even more limited. But I would probably vote for greater variety in the all-too-limited rye offerings out there.


06-06-2005, 14:18
I just noticed that the article you reference says that Jim Beam Rye is 6 years old. Do you think that can be counted on as correct? Although the article has much puffery (Old Overholt "made in small batches" - perhaps in Beam's general scheme of things, although I think I see it more often than the JB rye), that seems to be a pretty specific statement to be stretched. Perhaps they got some inside info? And it's probably too much to read into this that the OO and JB have different mashbills.

I've also seen some here say that the JB rye was quite good years ago in a "7 year old" configuration, but not now. So what could they have done in cutting it to six, and why? I can see going all the way to four, but why bring it out only one year early if the quality hit was so high? Or was this a case of 7 really being 10 in that era?

Then again, given the statement about Stagg, maybe it would be best to simply dismiss any factual statements in this article.