kickert Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 As promised folks, here are my notes on my recent visit to a new micro-distillery here in Bowling Green, KY. It is called Corsair Artisan and they just opened up with a formal ribbon cutting in mid February.The folks there were really great, willing to take time out of their days to talk about spirits and answer my endless questions. The building is mostly open space with two stills occupying one corner. There is a modern tasting room right in the front.Corsair has a refurbished pot still which is used for the first distillation of whiskey and then a new pot still with column that they use the second whiskey cut and all their other spirits. Right now they are producing a vanilla vodka, a gin, an unaged rye whiskey and a spiced rum. I was able to sample all of them and they were great. Not what you would expect, that that is their goal - to offer specialty products.Right now they have no aged whiskeys because it takes so long to turn out good product. However, they are working on it as we speak. I like the model of turning out good unaged products ahead of aged products rather than simply buying someone else's stock and passing it off as your own.When I visited they were distilling some absinthe. Talk about a speciality liquor. It was top notch, and a unique product for sure.They are more than willing to let others tour. I have posted pictures on my facebook but anyone should be able to see them:http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=52511&l=1e3f2&id=504187490 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickert Posted January 10, 2009 Author Share Posted January 10, 2009 By the way... I asked about their rye mashbill and they said it was 100% rye. That was the first I had ever heard of it. I was able to smell the unaged rye, but did not taste it (so I guess I did not taste everything they had).-bk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILLfarmboy Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 Thanks for posting that, Ben I'm always interested in micro/ artisanal distilleries. The rye distillate, what was the percentage of malted rye? 100% ? I seem to remember reading somewhere that 20/80 (malted/unmalted) had been used in the past as an historical standard for an all rye distillate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickert Posted January 11, 2009 Author Share Posted January 11, 2009 I am not sure how much of their recipie is malted rye vs. unmalted rye. I will ask and get back to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funknik Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 By the way... I asked about their rye mashbill and they said it was 100% rye. That was the first I had ever heard of it. I was able to smell the unaged rye, but did not taste it (so I guess I did not taste everything they had).-bkI've read about this before....I heard Old Potrero claims 100% rye, but I think you need barley for fermentation...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rughi Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 I've read about this before....I heard Old Potrero claims 100% rye, but I think you need barley for fermentation......Some malted Grain (10% is common) is needed for the enzymes that promote saccharification of the starches, (unless enzmes are added in). It's convenient but not necessary that it be barley.Potrero is indeed 100% malted rye. Fritz was the first I know of to use the term "single malt" other than for barley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiskeyTaichou Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 We used 100% malted rye, no barley, no other enzymes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiskeyTaichou Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 We are about to start another batch, I will take pics and post them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rughi Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 We are about to start another batch, I will take pics and post them.Welcome, CorsairI look forward to seeing your efforts. You'll find there are many people on this forum who are rooting for you and your brethren.Judging from your website logo, I'm looking forward to you coming up with a "Mr. Red" rye cocktail and a "Mr. Pink" vodka drink.Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiskeyTaichou Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Thanks for the good words. We microdistillers truly feel like we are in a David and Goliath situation. You read things like Jack Daniels to spend $40 million in advertising this year and it can be overwhelming. As a Tennessean I love the brand of Jack, but we do feel outgunned by the big boys. Of course we feel like we can take risks and do creative things the big boys never would. As for the logo we certainly love reservoir dogs and relate to the attitude. We wanted a logo very different from anything we had seen and worked with a comic book artist to get the right look. Well good night, I'm going to sample a run of absinthe we did yesterday and drown some of my Titans losing to the Ravens yesterday sorrows. Happy drinking!WT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virus_Of_Life Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 That's very cool! Thanks Ben for posting it and thank you WhiskeyTaichou for joining and sharing some more information. As Roger said we're all rooting for a micro distillery to take a foot hold and start putting out some unique new product!BTW, I like the bottle you chose for your product it is used for other things of course, but many of us here know it from the WT American Spirit release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiskeyTaichou Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Thanks! One challenge the micro-nauts all face is some of the coolest bottles can only be ordered in huge numbers. And custom bottles can cost a fortune. We really liked the small Tuthilltown bottles and it was the 375 ml version that sold us. Again, thanks for the good words of encouragement. Take care.WT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I'm glad to see Vendome is finally getting into this game. A lot of these European manufacturers have been leading folks astray because they don't know or care about American distilling traditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiskeyTaichou Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 It was extremely important to us to use an American company and especially one with such a rich history. The Christian Carl and Bavarian Holstein stills are beauties no doubt. However it was also great to be able to jump in a car and drive up and see the progress made on our stills. The degree of communication to get exactly what we wanted would not have been possible with the european countries due to language and time zones. I can't say enough good things about Vendome. Anyone who loves distillery tours should go tour their shop. It is amazing. WT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigthom Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Do they give tours? I've driven by there a few times, but I didn't stop. Some doors were open so I peeked inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokinjoe Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Do they give tours? I've driven by there a few times, but I didn't stop. Some doors were open so I peeked inside.The website says they do, but best to make an appointment first.http://www.corsairartisan.com/index-6.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickert Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 I toured there the other day, and as Joe pointed out it is by appointment right now. They are having their big opening in Mid February. I emailed Andrew (andrew@webber.net) to set it up. He is a really nice guy. WhiskeyTaichou who has been posting on the board here recently is the other main guy (Darek) at Corsair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jono Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Great news! Wishing them much success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 As important as Vendome is, they are a very small, family operation. That's probably why they were late to the micro-distillery game, they were just too busy that day. Some micro-distillers have told me that Vendome wouldn't return their calls. It's probably more like Vendome just didn't return their calls, because they were buried at the time. I'm tickled to see Corsair worked closely with Vendome. Simply put, Vendome knows how to make stills for American whiskey and if you want to make American whiskey, you should talk to Vendome first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 The website says they do, but best to make an appointment first.http://www.corsairartisan.com/index-6.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 We used 100% malted rye, no barley, no other enzymes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshani Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 The malting process changes the character of the rye a bit. Some of the spiciness mellows and there's a bit more sweetness that comes over with malted rye versus unmalted rye grain. I think some 100% ryes use, say, 80% malted and 20% unmalted rye to get a bit more sharpness.We're rather fond of the spirit that an all malted rye wash produces so are sticking to 100% malt. We are using a couple different rye malts for a bit more complexity instead.I'm looking forward to trying some of your whiskey when you get Illinois distribution. What you're selling right now, if it were made completely in pot stills, is probably very close to what the earliest American distillers were making. That in itself is of great historical interest, even if the initial distillation is through a column still.I wonder if a mixture of malted and unmalted rye would make a uniquely American take on the Irish Pure Pot Still, which uses malted and unmalted barley. Any plans to eventually age some of the product in charred barrels? I think an aged and unaged spirit would complement each other in many respects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 We'll be barreling 50% of our rye production and all of our bourbon production (unless there's a call for its white dog).When we visit distilleries that let you try the white dog, I always walk away thinking "man that stuff was good, I wish they sold it." So we're going to do just that. It makes business sense too, letting us sustain the business with white spirits while we age the whiskeys we'd ultimately like to shift to.Our wash still and spirit still are both pot stills. The spirit still does have plates in its column but we disable those. The big break with tradition is using a themal oil heater rather than direct fire. We can park our still's temperature at a specific point below 212 to get a subsection of the run, if we want, in addition to making cuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoshani Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 It makes business sense too, letting us sustain the business with white spirits while we age the whiskeys we'd ultimately like to shift to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowdery Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 What I have noticed, in sampling some micro-distillery products, is how big of a difference corn makes. One reason the macro straight ryes taste so much like bourbon, and so unlike a product such as Old Potrero (100% malted rye), is because they are typically just 51% rye and, therefore, probably 39% corn (plus 10% malt). Yet Bernheim wheat, which is exactly the same except wheat wheat instead of rye, tastes similar to an all-malt or all-small-grains whiskey, which I cannot explain.The difference when corn is present is not so much the flavor as the body. You just don't get that full body without a lot of corn. Yet the Bernheim, which is about 40% corn, reminds me of Stranahan's and some of the other micro-distillery malt whiskeys. Curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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