Smooth Ambler halts Barrel Selections for remainder of 2017

[flahute]

Straight from the horses mouth, just how we like it.

[Louisiana]

 

Thanks for the input. How much more are the sourced barrels costing without you getting into any specific numbers. 25%, 50%, or 100% more? I understand if you cant answer this question for privacy issues. Just curious.

 

Cheers, Jeff

 

 

[Artful Drinker]

14 minutes ago, Louisiana said:

 

Thanks for the input. How much more are the sourced barrels costing without you getting into any specific numbers. 25%, 50%, or 100% more? I understand if you cant answer this question for privacy issues. Just curious.

 

Cheers, Jeff

 

 

2-3X

[Louisiana]

 

24 minutes ago, Artful Drinker said:

2-3X

 

I see your dilemma. That would be a dramatic increase indeed. Thanks again for your input.

 

Cheers, Jeff

 

 

 

[Hop]

Artful - Thanks for the clarification.  I've been wanting to make the trip to see the facility and your impending release of the Wheater will be my trigger.  That along with how transparent OS has been in their dealings with the consumer.

[jvd99]

Good stuff Artful - thanks for the info.

[Limegoldconvertible68]

As someone who unleashed on Beam last year I find this truly refreshing. A company having to make difficult decisions but still respecting their customers. I applaud you guys for this and love the way you are honoring West Virginia. I have been someone who only bought bourbon produced in Kentucky but have won me over with this.  Thank you!

[Golferpimp1]

Thanks for the time and response, we truly appreciate the thoughts and perspective. And I for one really enjoy your product.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk

[Old Dusty]

3 hours ago, Artful Drinker said:

 we'd have to ask folks to pay dramatically more for it at retail than we currently do.  Same whiskey, same proof.  Higher priced one day than it was the day before.  Would a lot of people be happy paying that?  We think it's unlikely.



JF

Man, this sounds familiar. Like another distillery may have done this......I just can't put my finger on it. Maybe the sun will come up and shine a beam of light on me so I can remember the maker. Or maybe it's in a book er something. 

[jackthedog]

Apologies if I missed this in the thread but are all Single Barrel offerings being discontinued or just store specific/private selections? 

 

I also appreciate the direct info. Thanks for engaging! 

[jeffrey r]

Appreciate the input there, Artful Drinker.  As usual, Smooth Ambler's transparency and honesty are much appreciated.  To be frank, SA's previous honesty about the looming shortages enabled me to pick up some backup bottles of SA bourbon, and more importantly to me, enabled me to stock up a bit on the ryes.  Your CS ryes are some of the best whiskeys out there at any price, in my opinion.  And your core 7 year/99 proof rye was one of the best bang for the buck whiskeys available, again in my opinion.  I am well stocked on your ryes for a good long while, and that is a reassuring thought.  Best of luck in the future. 

[0895]

1 hour ago, Old Dusty said:

Man, this sounds familiar. Like another distillery may have done this......I just can't put my finger on it. Maybe the sun will come up and shine a beam of light on me so I can remember the maker. Or maybe it's in a book er something. 

LMAO!

[The Black Tot]

Much appreciated, Artful.

 

I'm sorry to read that aged output was dependent on buying jump-started barrels already with a few years on 'em.

 

Sorry most of all because 2017 was when I was finally going to get my shine-ola together to get up to Maxwelton and pick a few barrels! The oil market in 2016 pretty much chopped me off at the knees for last year.

 

Do you have plans to add significant additional rackhouse space in the near future so that you could add enough white dog to get yourselves out of this situation in the long term? I realize that doesn't solve the short term, but it would be great to see you guys upgrade your capacity. We at SB.com have certainly been spreading the gospel about our love for SAOS and we'd love to see your output grow.

 

We recognize, as you've mentioned, that you're one of the good guys in this industry. We're all rooting for you!

Edited January 18, 2017 by The Black Tot

[Artful Drinker]

2 hours ago, jackthedog said:

Apologies if I missed this in the thread but are all Single Barrel offerings being discontinued or just store specific/private selections? 

 

I also appreciate the direct info. Thanks for engaging! 

Only the custom is going away.  The regular "house chosen" Single Barrel will remain, though in some tighter quantities.

[Artful Drinker]

1 hour ago, jeffrey r said:

Appreciate the input there, Artful Drinker.  As usual, Smooth Ambler's transparency and honesty are much appreciated.  To be frank, SA's previous honesty about the looming shortages enabled me to pick up some backup bottles of SA bourbon, and more importantly to me, enabled me to stock up a bit on the ryes.  Your CS ryes are some of the best whiskeys out there at any price, in my opinion.  And your core 7 year/99 proof rye was one of the best bang for the buck whiskeys available, again in my opinion.  I am well stocked on your ryes for a good long while, and that is a reassuring thought.  Best of luck in the future. 

Thank you.  I can't say it enough.  We hate this as much as anybody, but we just didn't have a lot of options.

I know this isn't a commercial but I think Old Scout American whiskey is underappreciated.  It's bourbon in every way but the use of the rejuvenated barrel.  It's 99 proof, not chill filtered, and should be selling for around $34.  You mentioned "bang for the buck" and OSAW is in my humble but admittedly biased opinion, a great value and a great everyday whiskey.  Does it drink like the 7, 10, or Single Barrel?  Hell no.  Who would expect it to?  But I'll do the "Pepsi Challenge" with it against any other 99 proof, non chill filtered, American/Bourbon-ish Whiskey out there. And I'd be willing to bet you know more of the provenance of OSAW then the other bottles.  I think it has a lot of body for its age, Andy busts his ass making a killer blend out of it, and it gets better every day.

Does that mean everybody's gonna like it?  Nope.  But it's not a throwaway, phoned-in, bullshit whiskey either.  Give it a shot if you miss the 7.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Artful Drinker

[Artful Drinker]

40 minutes ago, The Black Tot said:

Much appreciated, Artful.

 

I'm sorry to read that aged output was dependent on buying jump-started barrels already with a few years on 'em.

 

Sorry most of all because 2017 was when I was finally going to get my shine-ola together to get up to Maxwelton and pick a few barrels! The oil market in 2016 pretty much chopped me off at the knees for last year.

 

Do you have plans to add significant additional rackhouse space in the near future so that you could add enough white dog to get yourselves out of this situation in the long term? I realize that doesn't solve the short term, but it would be great to see you guys upgrade your capacity. We at SB.com have certainly been spreading the gospel about our love for SAOS and we'd love to see your output grow.

 

We recognize, as you've mentioned, that you're one of the good guys in this industry. We're all rooting for you!

Thanks for your support.  It means more to us than you know.  We have 6 rickhouses ready to go right now and have plans this year to essentially triple our in-house production.  We are doing exactly what you hope in the effort to not have this problem, or to have less of a problem at least, with our house made stuff.

As for the sourced/merchant bottled whiskey, we like to think we're a pretty good partner for somebody who wants to sell good whiskey by the barrel.  When it becomes available at prices we can manage, and/or the young whiskey have now come into its own, (and both of those things WILL happen eventually), I think we'll be having a very different conversation about supply.

Listen, we're not allergic to money.  We just wanna earn it in a way that allows us to shoot you straight about what we're doing and why we have to do it.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Artful Drinker

[fishnbowljoe]

Thanks AD. As others have said, honest and straight forward. And yes that's refreshing. Keep up the good work. You being a part of our community here is much appreciated.

 

Cheers! Joe

[jackthedog]

Thanks for the reply. The direct information is greatly appreciated. One of your single barrels holds the distinction of being one of the best bourbons I've ever had. So, I'm glad they're sticking around. 

[musekatcher]

3 hours ago, Artful Drinker said:

Thanks for your support.  It means more to us than you know.  We have 6 rickhouses ready to go right now and have plans this year to

 

Great insite, thanks.  I've been vocally skeptical about the behavior of the majors and price escalation on basic brands that equates to nothing but a sticker change to maximize profits, and risk loyalty.  But, with the root cause being demand due to newcomers, they run the risk of selling out if they are under-priced.  We just have to remind ourselves that demand has increased faster than expected when planning the 4-6 year stocks, and these newcomers are calibrated to spending more than we are.  Dang it....

[Richnimrod]

Good, honest (if not welcome) explanation; straight from the horse's mouth.    Can't beat that!

I echo the words of fishnbowljoe.    Great to have you on the board, Artful Drinker; and so willing to share your thoughts with us Bourbon geeks.    Glad you're here.

[Vosgar]

7 hours ago, Old Dusty said:

Man, this sounds familiar. Like another distillery may have done this......I just can't put my finger on it. Maybe the sun will come up and shine a beam of light on me so I can remember the maker. Or maybe it's in a book er something. 

 

Outstanding post Eric!  

[smokinjoe]

50 minutes ago, musekatcher said:

 ...and these newcomers are calibrated to spending more than we are.  Dang it....

 

Turn that around...."old" timers are calibrated to spending less.  Why?  Because we've been paying under market pricing for bourbon for decades.  It's been said a thousand times:  Bourbon is a great value.  In this market that's a nice way to say its under priced.   "Newcomers" have a better understanding of  current "competitive" market pricing across   whiskey offerings, and will pay market without the dissonance experienced by old timers, which has been created by years of scooping up gobs of high quality, but cheap glut whiskey.  

[0895]

6 hours ago, Artful Drinker said:

Listen, we're not allergic to money.  We just wanna earn it in a way that allows us to shoot you straight about what we're doing and why we have to do it.

 

Love your products and your business approach.... and tell Sarah to keep up the good work on the bottling line!

[The Black Tot]

To be fair Joe I think we left underpriced behind at least a few years back. Where we're at now is "somebody please hit the brakes, our rackhouses are being raped!!!" pricing.

 

I think we have to reach steady production equilibrium with supply matching demand before we can look at appropriate valuation fairly. This is a pressurized market currently under some pretty extreme stress.

 

I look at spirits in context of the state of other budgetary items. When some of the limiteds are now costing more than a car payment (and for a pretty good car too!), that's not natural valuation for fermented rye, corn, and barley that sat in a barrel.

 

It's not just about it catching up to single malt, it's about people being willing to put way more of their disposable income into drinking, (again i'm saying proportionally vs the general cost of living), than has ever happened. It's not that bourbon finally caught up to scotch - because scotch went up too, and is STILL more expensive like for like than bourbon is.

 

I'm not comfortable with being more willing to throw larger wads of cash at commodities being equated with "a better understanding" of markets. I'd say it's more the opposite.

 

But this is probably for the "boom peak" thread.

 

 

[smokinjoe]

8 hours ago, The Black Tot said:

To be fair Joe I think we left underpriced behind at least a few years back. Where we're at now is "somebody please hit the brakes, our rackhouses are being raped!!!" pricing.

 

I think we have to reach steady production equilibrium with supply matching demand before we can look at appropriate valuation fairly. This is a pressurized market currently under some pretty extreme stress.

 

I look at spirits in context of the state of other budgetary items. When some of the limiteds are now costing more than a car payment (and for a pretty good car too!), that's not natural valuation for fermented rye, corn, and barley that sat in a barrel.

 

It's not just about it catching up to single malt, it's about people being willing to put way more of their disposable income into drinking, (again i'm saying proportionally vs the general cost of living), than has ever happened. It's not that bourbon finally caught up to scotch - because scotch went up too, and is STILL more expensive like for like than bourbon is.

 

I'm not comfortable with being more willing to throw larger wads of cash at commodities being equated with "a better understanding" of markets. I'd say it's more the opposite.

 

But this is probably for the "boom peak" thread.

 

 

It's ALL about the markets.