When Are You Apart Of The Problem?

[mal00768]

I’ve never needed to clear the shelf. WT101 and RR are always available. 

[fishnbowljoe]

I was researching something bourbon related this morning on the internet when I came across something interesting, and disturbing. Among several links to bourbon sites, I found one for semi private bourbon site. There they talked about prices and what not. The thing that was disturbing were the posts about specific products being delivered to specific liquor stores. I knew that some folks had good ideas of delivery days and some even went so far as to follow delivery trucks. I also know people and sites communicated some things like this between them. I had no idea the full scope of things as to just how far some folks go, and how cut throat things had become. Here are a few examples of the posts there. “DEF liquors at so and so.”  Posted with a pic of a couple of Blanton’s “Binny’s drops today? Haven’t seen Stagg jr or Blanton’s.” “Costco NW burbs.” Posted with a picture of a shelf full of the new MM Wood Finishing Series in. “WSR, ER, W4R, Hancock’s and more at GHI liquors.” ”ECBP B520  @ Costco in blah blah. $43.99.” “Woodman’s delivery days. Does anyone know Woodman’s delivery days? Everyone knows Binny’s, just curious about Woodman’s. Any help would be great.”  
 

To me, this is some truly sad s**t.  What a bunch of f **king lazy ass hats.  I hope this didn’t offend anyone here. Sorry if it did. I just had to vent. Even though this site isn’t based in my particular “neck of the woods”, there are implications that it may affect my area even though I’m over 90 miles away. Nuff ‘Ced. 
 

Joe

[JCwhammie]

1 hour ago, fishnbowljoe said:

To me, this is some truly sad s**t.  What a bunch of f **king lazy ass hats.  I hope this didn’t offend anyone here. Sorry if it did. I just had to vent. Even though this site isn’t based in my particular “neck of the woods”, there are implications that it may affect my area even though I’m over 90 miles away. Nuff ‘Ced. 
 

Joe

I 100% agree. I also wonder what these people do for a living and what their home life (family) is like. 

 

I assume when they meet new people who ask about their hobbies and they say "I follow liquor distributor trucks around town in hopes of scoring allocated bourbon at retail price so I can try flipping them" they are responded to with a sarcastic...

[Kepler]

@fishnbowljoe

Joe this is essentially what many of the local private Facebook groups are all about, under the surface with their core veteran members anyway.  That, and secondary flipping.

I agree it is sad, and yes they are asshats.

Edited August 21, 2020 by Kepler

[mal00768]

1 hour ago, fishnbowljoe said:

I was researching something bourbon related this morning on the internet when I came across something interesting, and disturbing. Among several links to bourbon sites, I found one for semi private bourbon site. There they talked about prices and what not. The thing that was disturbing were the posts about specific products being delivered to specific liquor stores. I knew that some folks had good ideas of delivery days and some even went so far as to follow delivery trucks. I also know people and sites communicated some things like this between them. I had no idea the full scope of things as to just how far some folks go, and how cut throat things had become. Here are a few examples of the posts there. “DEF liquors at so and so.”  Posted with a pic of a couple of Blanton’s “Binny’s drops today? Haven’t seen Stagg jr or Blanton’s.” “Costco NW burbs.” Posted with a picture of a shelf full of the new MM Wood Finishing Series in. “WSR, ER, W4R, Hancock’s and more at GHI liquors.” ”ECBP B520  @ Costco in blah blah. $43.99.” “Woodman’s delivery days. Does anyone know Woodman’s delivery days? Everyone knows Binny’s, just curious about Woodman’s. Any help would be great.”  
 

To me, this is some truly sad s**t.  What a bunch of f **king lazy ass hats.  I hope this didn’t offend anyone here. Sorry if it did. I just had to vent. Even though this site isn’t based in my particular “neck of the woods”, there are implications that it may affect my area even though I’m over 90 miles away. Nuff ‘Ced. 
 

Joe

I gave up on Facebook groups because they were filled with people posting crotch shots and asking for validation, or the constant pictures of allocated bottles with references to how everyone else is a tater, etc, etc.

 

Hunting is not that fun for me. I just want to walk into the store, buy something tasty, and go crack it open with friends.

[shuttlenote]

Agree with tailing trucks/camping out on delivery days, but I'll occasionally post up if I see something that's unique just to let the local community get a shot at something they wouldn't have otherwise. 

[fishnbowljoe]

Thanks for the comments  @JCwhammie, @Kepler and @mal00768. I knew this stuff went on, but not the scale of it.

 

I'm glad I have a pretty good bunker. I'm also glad I like things like regular BT, EW BIB, and a few others.  I can see retirement on the horizon, that is partly why I've been purchasing a few things lately. Gotta get while the gettins still good.

 

Biba! Joe

[liquidbarrels]

1 hour ago, fishnbowljoe said:

I was researching something bourbon related this morning on the internet when I came across something interesting, and disturbing. Among several links to bourbon sites, I found one for semi private bourbon site. There they talked about prices and what not. The thing that was disturbing were the posts about specific products being delivered to specific liquor stores. I knew that some folks had good ideas of delivery days and some even went so far as to follow delivery trucks. I also know people and sites communicated some things like this between them. I had no idea the full scope of things as to just how far some folks go, and how cut throat things had become. Here are a few examples of the posts there. “DEF liquors at so and so.”  Posted with a pic of a couple of Blanton’s “Binny’s drops today? Haven’t seen Stagg jr or Blanton’s.” “Costco NW burbs.” Posted with a picture of a shelf full of the new MM Wood Finishing Series in. “WSR, ER, W4R, Hancock’s and more at GHI liquors.” ”ECBP B520  @ Costco in blah blah. $43.99.” “Woodman’s delivery days. Does anyone know Woodman’s delivery days? Everyone knows Binny’s, just curious about Woodman’s. Any help would be great.”  
 

To me, this is some truly sad s**t.  What a bunch of f **king lazy ass hats.  I hope this didn’t offend anyone here. Sorry if it did. I just had to vent. Even though this site isn’t based in my particular “neck of the woods”, there are implications that it may affect my area even though I’m over 90 miles away. Nuff ‘Ced. 
 

Joe

Joe, that truly is pathetic. Goes to show what lengths people will go to. I'm in the NW burbs of Chicago and I have consistently gone to the same store over the years and tried to build a relationship with the people working there. From bourbon, scotch, to beer, wine, and cigars/accessories. IMO better than going LS hopping to find a bottle

[afmadd]

On 8/19/2020 at 12:46 AM, Kepler said:

 

I think anytime you horde a shelf full of very hard to find bourbon (e.g. Stagg Jr) at a low MSRP with the intent of flipping it either on the secondary market or just as "gift" or "trade" bait even for friends, yes that is being part of the problem.  It's all a form of flipping.

 

Lord knows I've assembled a huge bunker but it's 100% for consumption.

Gifting and trading seem very different things here.  

[TwoFingers]

19 hours ago, fishnbowljoe said:

I knew this stuff went on, but not the scale of it.

I've seen this sort of thing with beer, so I am not surprised it happens with bourbon.  I'll stick with my usual pours and be happy when I come across something of real interest to me, knowing of course there might be few opportunities with antics like this going on.

[0895]

21 hours ago, fishnbowljoe said:

Thanks for the comments  @JCwhammie, @Kepler and @mal00768. I knew this stuff went on, but not the scale of it.

 

I'm glad I have a pretty good bunker. I'm also glad I like things like regular BT, EW BIB, and a few others.  I can see retirement on the horizon, that is partly why I've been purchasing a few things lately. Gotta get while the gettins still good.

 

Biba! Joe

Once you retire, you’ll be able to join in on all that fun every single day!

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

22 hours ago, fishnbowljoe said:

Thanks for the comments  @JCwhammie, @Kepler and @mal00768. I knew this stuff went on, but not the scale of it.

 

I'm glad I have a pretty good bunker. I'm also glad I like things like regular BT, EW BIB, and a few others.  I can see retirement on the horizon, that is partly why I've been purchasing a few things lately. Gotta get while the gettins still good.

 

Biba! Joe

I hear you Joe. I recently learned about a Chicago FB group who’s whole stated purpose is to immediately notify everyone when something desirable lands. 
 

I’ll guess these are also the guys who are pushy and demanding because they “know the store received it”

[Kepler]

23 hours ago, shuttlenote said:

Agree with tailing trucks/camping out on delivery days, but I'll occasionally post up if I see something that's unique just to let the local community get a shot at something they wouldn't have otherwise. 

 

1 hour ago, Bob_Loblaw said:

I hear you Joe. I recently learned about a Chicago FB group who’s whole stated purpose is to immediately notify everyone when something desirable lands. 
 

I’ll guess these are also the guys who are pushy and demanding because they “know the store received it”

 

This is why we can't find some of our favorites on the shelf unless we just happen to get lucky on delivery day.  Social media posting ensures every bottle will be gone within a matter of hours. 

Why not resist blasting the news across cyberspace and instead just let shoppers find the stuff organically?

[PaulO]

1 hour ago, Bob_Loblaw said:

I hear you Joe. I recently learned about a Chicago FB group who’s whole stated purpose is to immediately notify everyone when something desirable lands. 
 

I’ll guess these are also the guys who are pushy and demanding because they “know the store received it”

What happens when two or more of said group show up at the same place at the same time.

 

Granted, I've got better things to do.

I would love to join such a group.  I'd recycle some old photos.  Then I'd send those clowns to liquor stores in the highest crime areas in the region. I could check the Trib for some real hot spots.  "ETL & Blanton's just landed on the South side!"   Be sure to insist, because they do have it.

[Flyfish]

Those of us who are virtuous have a moral and social obligation to buy up as much stuff as possible to keep the hoarders from getting it.

[smokinjoe]

1 minute ago, Flyfish said:

Those of us who are virtuous have a moral and social obligation to buy up as much stuff as possible to keep the hoarders from getting it.

Heehee!  .  

[0895]

3 hours ago, Kepler said:

 

Why not resist blasting the news across cyberspace and instead just let shoppers find the stuff organically?

because that’s not showing all your cyber friends/followers how awesome you are... 

its all about the likes, brotato chip.

 

Seriously.

Give it a freaking rest.  

These guys legit do this all day, every Monday-Friday.
It’s way worse now that people are “working from home” and can go out whenever to the store.

Edited August 22, 2020 by 0895

[Bob_Loblaw]

On 8/22/2020 at 1:24 PM, Kepler said:

Why not resist blasting the news across cyberspace and instead just let shoppers find the stuff organically?

On 8/22/2020 at 5:02 PM, 0895 said:

because that’s not showing all your cyber friends/followers how awesome you are... 

its all about the likes, brotato chip.

So true. Not an hour after I posted here a buddy sent me a screen shot someone else posted on Facebook proudly displaying the recently dropped ER, BT and WFP store picks and encouraging everyone to “go get theirs”. Of course, Mr. Great Guy OP is only posting after securing his bottles. . . 
 

To me, these asshats are fishing with dynamite and have no regard for impact on environment (bourbon market) or the mess they leave behind. 

 

[fishnbowljoe]

On 8/22/2020 at 8:11 AM, afmadd said:

Gifting and trading seem very different things here.  

It is.

[fishnbowljoe]

On 8/22/2020 at 11:21 AM, 0895 said:

Once you retire, you’ll be able to join in on all that fun every single day!

 

Screw that.   My wife is a year younger than me. When she retires, hopefully things will be like the old Army recruiting slogan from many, many years ago. Join The Army, Fun Travel Adventure. FTA. Of course those of us in the Army back then scoffed at that notion and came up with our own FTA slogan. F**K THE ARMY! 

 

Biba! Joe

[smokinjoe]

31 minutes ago, Bob_Loblaw said:

So true. Not an hour after I posted here a buddy sent me a screen shot someone else posted on Facebook proudly displaying the recently dropped ER, BT and WFP store picks and encouraging everyone to “go get theirs”. Of course, Mr. Great Guy OP is only posting after securing his bottles. . . 
 

To me, these asshats are fishing with dynamite and have no regard for impact on environment (bourbon market) or the mess they leave behind. 

 

Bob, I so want to hate on what transpired there in what you described, but I look inward and and to other “good” folks (like I think I might be, but am not) and see similar things, but under different and supposedly more righteous pretexts.  I just can’t totally make that break between Good and Evil...I am not endorsing this behavior, but it would be disingenuous for most of us to totally vilify it, lest we all be guilty.

[Mako254]

On 8/19/2020 at 11:44 AM, Bob_Loblaw said:

It would be a rare situation where I would clear a shelf nowadays.  Partly because most coveted bottles are behind counters or lotteried etc . . . Partly for karma.  Partly for cost and to space out purchases and build rapport.  I'd say technically if you are ever buying a bottle with thoughts towards anything other than consumption or gifting you are contributing to the overall problem.  

 

That said, to play devil's advocate in this situation, a few questions just to stir the pot:

 

Isn't the retailer here really the biggest part of the problem?  The good ones get a bottle into 6 good or new customer's hands and build loyalty.  Here, they are incentivizing a case purchase.  15% is crazy on an allocated bourbon case.  For those who said you would leave exactly one bottle behind for the next guy would you really buy 5 at $250 vs all 6 at $255?  

 

Why do we generally consider shelf clearing of newly released allocated products bad, but over in the dusty thread a hoard of 8yr WT101 is cleared and its high fives all around?  Is it because the dusty bottles have had ample time to be found by the public?  Kind of like a statute of limitations?  Do the karma rules not apply to dusties?

 

 

I won’t clear a shelf if it is something I know lots of folks are looking for. 
 

If the bottles in question are from a singlw barrel and have been there ‘awhile’ then it is fair game IMO.

 

I came across a 2016 Russells this summer at $53/btl. They all found good homes. 

[smokinjoe]

32 minutes ago, Mako254 said:

I won’t clear a shelf if it is something I know lots of folks are looking for. 

What if those folks are your buddies?  8 buddies looking for the 8 bottles that you just found?  

[Bob_Loblaw]

31 minutes ago, smokinjoe said:

Bob, I so want to hate on what transpired there in what you described, but I look inward and and to other “good” folks (like I think I might be, but am not) and see similar things, but under different and supposedly more righteous pretexts.  I just can’t totally make that break between Good and Evil...I am not endorsing this behavior, but it would be disingenuous for most of us to totally vilify it, lest we all be guilty.

You know, I sometimes forget how tone and such can be lost in written posts.  I did not necessarily mean to take that strong of a position.  Of course, it's easy to pass judgment on those floundering in the current bourbon rat race while many of us here have tried and true relationships.  I have the upmost confidence that my local will make sure I get a bottle before releasing to the hordes.  I do maintain that the practice of publicly posting recent scores is bad for bourbon as a whole.  For every "good" dude in the group  I would wager there are 3 flippers.  It's annoying for the store (who just hooked up you) and it could make it more difficult  for the same individual who posted to get future releases as he just clued the whole world in on where to go.   It is just shortsighted imo.  I think I made the analogy somewhere here before, but to me flippers are like jerk drivers, they exist all over and there is little you can do about them so no point getting all that worked up about it.   

[PaulO]

What if someone is a flipper and a jerk driver.

I bet there is a lot of overlap.