Buffalo Trace - Experimental Collection

[TNbourbon]

Personally, I suspect many of them will never see a retail shelf. It's my understanding BT is directing them to specific, valued retailers in small quantities of under half-a-case -- many times just a bottle or two. Thus, many likely will go directly into those retailers' private collections, or be sold privately to those retailers' best customers.

In short, any one of us is just going to have to get lucky, and be the right person at the right place at the right time.

[NorCalBoozer]

I wish all distilleries would at least put the barrelled date and bottled date on labels....as we can see with items like some of the Van Winkles, its going to become impossible to know which verision we have and now whats on the selves is unknown. Not that one is worse or better, but we just won't know unless we bought it before the change, but even then we'd have to make sure to note it somehow.

Everything is the same except what's in the bottle. Thats why I wish we could have the dates on there.

I love those labels. I'd buy production bourbon with such labels. Much better than those that contain folklore about historical figures and places combined with a flowerly restatement of the legal definition of bourbon.

Yours truly,

Dave Morefield

[TMH]

I wish all distilleries would at least put the barrelled date and bottled date on labels

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought most bottles without a barrel date are from several barrels with different ages, which is done in order to meet the brand taste profile.

I'm honestly a little disappointed with what I've seen so far of the experimental collection. I was excited about it until I saw the pictures and read the bottle proof and saw "chill filtered" on the label. Why go all the way to make an unusual product and charge a premium price if you are going to turn it into a regular product in the end? Does anyone know if any of the bottles will be barrel proof or non-chill filtered? Perhaps I'll have to wait for the Signatory bottlings.:grin:

[gothbat]

They definitely sound interesting but I’m kinda turned off about the small bottle size and, to a lesser extent, the $45 - $50 price tag. I know the size is small because they are so limited but for some reason spending 2x the price on a regular size bottle is more appealing and considerable to me. If I saw one for sale and the price wasn’t too jacked up I’d probably buy it, after all they do sound intriguing, but I don’t think I would go out of my way to get one even if I lived somewhere where it seemed possible that a store within a 50 or 60 mile radius might have one.

[NorCalBoozer]

Hi Tim, good point about different aged bourbons. I would at least appreciate a bottled date for those that are mixtures of different barrel years. Just that bit of information would be of great value.

What if Sazerac or ER 17 didn't have a bottle year on it? The bottles would be of less value because you couldn't be able to differentiate and taste test year vs. year.

on the flip side, something like Pappy 20, Lot B, the Old Rips, etc would reach a higher value by giving year by year differentiation.

Seems like an easy thing to do that would benefit both the consumer and distiller.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought most bottles without a barrel date are from several barrels with different ages, which is done in order to meet the brand taste profile.

I'm honestly a little disappointed with what I've seen so far of the experimental collection. I was excited about it until I saw the pictures and read the bottle proof and saw "chill filtered" on the label. Why go all the way to make an unusual product and charge a premium price if you are going to turn it into a regular product in the end? Does anyone know if any of the bottles will be barrel proof or non-chill filtered? Perhaps I'll have to wait for the Signatory bottlings.:grin:

[Grant]

Here's a good article in the Louisville Kentucky Courier-Journal dated April 21, 2006 on these 3 experiments :

http://www.courierjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060421/BUSINESS/604210367&SearchID=73242330822605

Buffalo Trace only made one barrel of each version - enough for fewer than 1,200 small 375-milliliter bottles selling for about $46 each - which comes out to be about $55,000 - or $18,333 per barrel.

BTW - Cowdery is quoted in this article.

[TMH]

Greg,

I really like your idea about putting more bottling info on the label. I also really like the fact that there is info on ER 17. I'd like to see more on Stagg besides the proof. I do think some bottles are made up of too many barrels to list on the label; however, it would be interesting to know how many go into a bottle.

Some have raised the issue of the high price on these experimental bottles, as a reason for passing up on these bottles. Price for me isn't the main issue of why I'd pass on these bottles. If they were at barrel proof and not chill filtered, I could see them being worth the price or even a higher price. I guess I'm the only one writing on this thread who cares about proof and chill filtering, which is unfortunate. Both of these factors really do affect the bourbon. Given the small size of the production run, I'm really surprised BT decided to water down and filter the bourbon. I would guess BT knows something I don't know about their consumers. Perhaps even among SBers price really does matter in the end.

[BourbonSteve]

I'm in atlanta. Where can a body get one of these babies?!

[cowdery]

I'm in atlanta. Where can a body get one of these babies?!

Your best bet is to contact Buffalo Trace and let them guide you to the retailers in your area that are receiving an allocation.

You can also try the retailer finder on their web site, then contact the retailer and ask them. This has the benefit of sending a demand signal through the supply chain, which has long term benefits for the availablity of premium bourbons in your area.

[Rughi]

I guess I'm the only one writing on this thread who cares about proof and chill filtering...

Not at all, Tim. I wrote, and recomposed, and edited, and then deleted a message that I thought was too strongly worded. I lost at least 1/2 of my interest in these when I read that they are going to be stripped and diluted to that extent.

I do like the small bottle concept, though, a lot. I have dozens of bottles that are open, but rarely empty one (except for mixers and the bulk stuff that makes sauces). Fifty dollars for a small bottle gets me a few years worth of sipping, the way I do small pours and skip around between my open bottles. Two small bottles in my bunker would be much more useful to me than one big one.

Hey, Marketing Guys -

If I were ever asked to be in a survey, here are the two things I'd like to say:

1) The phrase "Un-chill Filtered" gets my attention more than anything else you can put on the label. To me it says "The Good Stuff" the way we're told "Bottled in Bond" was considered in the Good Ole Days.

2) Every time I consider buying an "under proof" bourbon (which to me means less than 100 proof) I do some mental math to calculate how diminished the bourbon is by water. I'll think things like "this is a blended bourbon; 72% barrel proof, 28% water." Then I usually get confused by the math, and wander off. :confused:

Really guys, is it wise to have bourbon customers trying to do math in their head when they're just trying to buy a drink? Consider the Wandering Off Factor - it could be considerable.

All that said, I buy a lot of Buffalo Trace products, and never turn one down.

Roger

[dougdog]

DITTO!..what Roger said...

Every part of it, and then some...

It's the "then some" part that I had to edit out....

doug--don't get me started---dog

(Truth be told, woulda loved to read what you deleted....)

[BourbonSteve]

thanks Chuck, I emailed them 2 weeks ago but never heard back.................

[NorCalBoozer]

Hey, Marketing Guys -

If I were ever asked to be in a survey, here are the two things I'd like to say:

1) The phrase "Un-chill Filtered" gets my attention more than anything else you can put on the label. To me it says "The Good Stuff" the way we're told "Bottled in Bond" was considered in the Good Ole Days.

Roger

ditto, I agree 100% with this point. I think BT, overall, is taking things in the right direction, and I hope others will take the opportunity to continue to push the quality envelope of bourbon.

[Vange]

I emailed my local vendor that had Pappy 23 and asked them if they could get any BT experimental or have heard anything about it. I will report back if there are successful and I can get multiple bottles for members of this forum. Cross your fingers.

[TNbourbon]

I'm glad to see so much enthusiasm about a bourbon release (I think!:skep:), but I also think there are too many folks with their hopes up. Reread that C-J article -- there are 100 retailers getting ANY. Nationwide. Worldwide. And nary a one of them is under any obligation to sell a single bottle. I know quite a few retailers who set aside special bottles for future speculation.

I, too, have put in a word with a retailer or two I think might be on Buffalo Trace's favored list. But I don't have any delusions about what it's going to take to get one or more of these -- luck, simply being the right guy in the right place when one comes up for sale.

[BobA]

BourbonSteve,

I fear the answer to your question is "out-of-state." I have never seen Stagg, ETL, or Saz in GA, or any VW rye, and I doubt they'll be sending this stuff here.

Bob

[whiskeymaven]

Hey guys. I'm sure this is one of many "experimental" BT whiskies. I was assured by the rep from BT that the success of the antique collection would further their exploration into different and experimental expressions. The fact of the matter is; it might not be that great, or at least a product they want to hold onto for a while. Not just the taste, but the idea. Bottles like these sell on their rareness, and as I can see almost all of us want one, or would at least pay a few bucks to try it.

[NorCalBoozer]

I've got my own "experiments" in a barrel in my garage and it didn't cost anywhere near $46 per 375 ml, and I'm including the barrel and starter bourbon.

[Vange]

This BTEC release is going to be a tough set to find anywhere! I have emailed tons of places and most are not going to ever even see it!!! Anyone else having more luck than me?

[jeff]

Nope. What little that's going to be around here was apparently spoken for months ago :cry:

[pepcycle]

I would like to put in a big plug for Party Source in Newport, KY.

Having expended all of my local options, I stopped in on my way back from Cinci.

I asked a few people on the floor about BTEC and got "deer in the headlights".

I asked for the spirits specialist and was introduced to Jay.

He was impressed that I drove from Lexington and indicated that he received an allocation and was calling his A-list customers to offer it to them.

:cool: :cool: :cool: :cool:

He offered me the last bottle. Firepot. I slipped in my own drool, only once on the way to the register.

Notwithstanding, this is a great store. They have cooking classes and tastings and a great web site. Ten times friendlier than Cork and Bottle.

When I went to C&B they gave me a lecture about charred new oak barrels and 51% corn, but couldn't tell me &^% about the BTEC. Kind of weird.

:smiley_acbt: :smiley_acbt:

[Edward_call_me_Ed]

Well, I know that I am not going to see any of these releases. If I do it will be at absurdly inflated prices. I am looking forward to the commercial releases that come from the experiments.

Ed

[Edward_call_me_Ed]

I do remember reading about a barrel of Glenmorangie Single Malt Scotch that was being aged in Kentucky at BT. Anyone hear how that turned out?

Ed

[cowdery]

I would like to put in a big plug for Party Source in Newport, KY.

Having expended all of my local options, I stopped in on my way back from Cinci.

I asked a few people on the floor about BTEC and got "deer in the headlights".

I asked for the spirits specialist and was introduced to Jay.

He was impressed that I drove from Lexington and indicated that he received an allocation and was calling his A-list customers to offer it to them.

:cool: :cool: :cool: :cool:

He offered me the last bottle. Firepot. I slipped in my own drool, only once on the way to the register.

Notwithstanding, this is a great store. They have cooking classes and tastings and a great web site. Ten times friendlier than Cork and Bottle.

When I went to C&B they gave me a lecture about charred new oak barrels and 51% corn, but couldn't tell me &^% about the BTEC. Kind of weird.

:smiley_acbt: :smiley_acbt:

I know Jay. Good guy. And a disciple of John Lipman, truth be told.

[JeffRenner]

I do remember reading about a barrel of Glenmorangie Single Malt Scotch that was being aged in Kentucky at BT. Anyone hear how that turned out?

That sounds suspicously like what I read about on p. 140 of Waymark and Harris's Classic American Whiseys (1995), but it was being aged at Marker's Mark, who provides the bourbon barrels for Glenmorangie. At this point, that malt should be well aged (considering Kentucky climate vs, Scotland), but I haven't heard anything more about it, either.

Jeff