Seattle and Washington Area Thread

[ChainWhip]

Welcome to SB DBM. We're in agreement with much of what you've posted - I am optimistic that things will turn for the better but it is difficult right now.

The lamest line I've heard attributed to the distributors (from more than a couple of retailers) is they have high prices on items because Washington state hasn't proven enough demand of said products in high enough volumes - Hello Mr. Chicken & Egg...

Seriously, how dumb do the distributors / retailers think consumers are? With a smartphone in just about every pocket, prices are easy to compare and it's obvious we are being ripped off (even before taxes).

In any event, glad to have you here - there is also a "New to SB" forum where people can introduce themselves to the community at large.

Edited February 26, 2013 by ChainWhip

[ChainWhip]

Scouted out TotalWine in Bellevue today and there's some new items (prices are inclusive of tax):

$75.12 4RSB OBSK for 3/16/2013 Bourbon Bash (Daniel's Broiler Selection)

$123.32 Fortaleza Anejo

$87.17 St. George Single Malt Whiskey Batch 12

$79.94 Hakushu 12

$75.12 Hibiki 12

$123.32 Laphroaig Cairdeas 2012 Origins

Stupid prices.

[DBM]

Yesterday Total Wine in Bellevue had Old Forester Birthday Bourbon 2012 for $49.99 (not including the many taxes) so I picked up a bottle. I'm guessing it just now made it through distribution because I hadn't seen it anywhere in Washington until that moment.

There's also still plenty of the 4RSB OBSK that ChainWhip mentioned earlier for the Daniel's Bourbon Bash, which I am sadly missing this year.

[ChainWhip]

I think that was at least the 2nd distribution to the Bellevue store but I picked up a bottle too.

Edited March 8, 2013 by ChainWhip

[ChuckBiscuits]

The Tukwilla Total Wine also has great customer service, a remarkable change from many of the people I encountered who were on the state payroll.

I have also found this to be true. Genuinely interested employees that want you to have a good retail experience. I don't know enough yet to comment upon their selection, but their beer prices are impossible to best in the area. World class selection, as well. Seattle has a few great "bottle shops", one of which is very close to home--Beer Junction. Bottleworks also deserves mention as being one of the first, and of course Chuck's Hop Shop at 85th and 6th in Ballard. None are cheap, but are certainly dedicated to bringing a huge selection of enthusiast brews to the area.

[squire]

I do favor places where the staff enjoy their work, which make my shopping more pleasant.

[derevaun]

I'm ambivalent but generally optimistic about the change. I used to have to drive to SODO or 7th/Bell to find my fave everyday pours (Old Forester and VOB BIB); now I can run over to Bevmo for Old Forester but have no clue where to find VOB. Anybody know, by the way?

[DBM]

I'm ambivalent but generally optimistic about the change. I used to have to drive to SODO or 7th/Bell to find my fave everyday pours (Old Forester and VOB BIB); now I can run over to Bevmo for Old Forester but have no clue where to find VOB. Anybody know, by the way?

[dementedavenger]

I wanted to see if I could fire up this thread again with some observations and such...

1. I picked up two bottles of ECBP at BevMo - Northgate on Friday. After tax they were $60 a pop. Not sure if there's anymore out there in the area but this was the third time I've seen it on the shelf at a BevMo.

2. Been seeing plenty of Rock Hill Farm and Weller 12 on the shelf. A lot of folks outside of the area say these area increasingly difficult to find. Of course, due to our taxes, you're going to end up spending $60 to $70 for the Rock Hill Farm and $40 for the Weller 12.

3. QFC at U-Village has a strong selection and decent prices. I've seen some FR Private Barrels pop up there and they've actually got a good bottom shelf selection.

4. Most ridiculous thing I've seen: Central Market in Shoreline is a great local grocery store and they've got a relatively strong bourbon selection all things considered (Smooth Ambler on the shelves). In the "high roller" room where they keep the expensive wine they've also got some whiskey, including about a dozen bottles of Whistle Pig 111 priced to move at ~$175. I get that they compete on price but whoever is doing the buying over the got snowed on this.

5. I recently bought 15+ bottles of bourbon/rye from The Party Source in Kentucky. This was mostly basic stuff like OGD114, AAA10, Willett Rye, etc. but stuff that I can't find here (or find here for a reasonable price). Shipping ended up working out to $4 per bottle. Big-time bargain.

6. Trader Joe's consistently has the best price for Buffalo Trace in the area. I want to say that it's $23.99 before tax but it could be $26.99. Can't remember, but it's cheaper than the chains or other grocery stores.

[suntour]

Any SBers in the Vancouver/Portland metro area?

I wonder if there's anything decent lurking across the border we may not be able to get here. I'd definitely pay the premium to get Weller 12.

[ChainWhip]

Hey DA-

Were those ECBP's 134.2's?

Thx for posting up the 411.

[ChainWhip]

Any SBers in the Vancouver/Portland metro area?

I wonder if there's anything decent lurking across the border we may not be able to get here. I'd definitely pay the premium to get Weller 12.

There's a Total Wine & BevMo in Vancouver so I'm going to guess and say yes. You can also check inventory online & pre purchase for pickup too.

[dementedavenger]

Hey DA-

Were those ECBP's 134.2's?

Thx for posting up the 411.

Yes. I haven't seen anything else out here.

[NWBourbonDrinker]

Time for a little rant about Washington: Visiting California and really surprised by the liquor price. Total Wine has Booker's for $59.99 in Washington and $49.99 in California. Tax in CA came out to approx. $3.50 for a total price of ~$52.50. In Washington you pay $2.83 Liter Tax at 20.5% Spirit Tax so your bottle is $59.99+$2.83 + $12.30 = $75.12! I just wonder is Washington realizes that this tax drives business out of the state? I buy the majority of my bottles online and while traveling now so Washington gets very little of my tax dollar. The ones who pay the majority are the lower end consumers who can't get out of state or buy online. Good job Washington!

[ChainWhip]

Time for a little rant about Washington: Visiting California and really surprised by the liquor price. Total Wine has Booker's for $59.99 in Washington and $49.99 in California. Tax in CA came out to approx. $3.50 for a total price of ~$52.50. In Washington you pay $2.83 Liter Tax at 20.5% Spirit Tax so your bottle is $59.99+$2.83 + $12.30 = $75.12! I just wonder is Washington realizes that this tax drives business out of the state? I buy the majority of my bottles online and while traveling now so Washington gets very little of my tax dollar. The ones who pay the majority are the lower end consumers who can't get out of state or buy online. Good job Washington!

The thing is, the tax is pretty much the same as before the state got out of the retail/distro business. The price hikes are almost entirely due to distributors like Young's & Southern jacking up the prices.

Here's what I wrote a distributor when they tried to pull the blame-the-state-tax argument:

I disagree that the tax structure is the main culprit (I'll concede that our tax rate is high but it has always been high). Let me give you an example:

Ardbeg 10:

> State-run Retail => $39.11 + 10.84 (tax) = $49.95 total [~27.7% effective tax rate]

> Total Wine => $46.99 + 20.5% tax ($9.63) + $2.83 (750ml pro-rated Liter Tax) = $59.45 [~26.5% effective tax rate]

I can send you a copy of the spreadsheet from the old state website (3/2012) if you'd like.

As you can see, the effective tax rate actually went down in this case (yes, I understand the Liter tax has a greater effect the lower the retail price of the bottle is, but I typically buy in this price range so this is where the rubber meets the road for me).

What I see (as an industry outsider/regular consumer) is a $10 price increase from the store in the area with the greatest purchasing power and hence should be able to offer the best prices. Where did that extra $10 come from? I'm not trying to blame anybody, but it's just really hard right now as a consumer in this state especially when I see that tax rates aren't really to blame for the price increases.

Basically, prices increased dramatically overnight when the liquor business privatized.

Edited August 19, 2013 by ChainWhip

[NWBourbonDrinker]

I understand and do not dispute your main point that taxes did not go up in the case of premium brands. I too am curious why the same bottle costs $10 more in Washington at the same retailer before taxes are applied.

The overall point though is that a money grabbing tax rate (one of the highest in the country) drives business out, lowers the overall sector revenue, and therefore lowers the amount of income for the government. It is simply wrong headed. The effect can be seen when crossing over to CA as the liquor warehouses straight across the border cater to Washington residents whom I saw loading up several boxes for their trip back home. A moderate tax rate would be a lot more productive and I bet it would bring in more tax revenue as well.

[ChainWhip]

You're right - the taxes still suck regardless ;-)

[dementedavenger]

The high cost coming from the distributors is most apparent when you go into a locally-owned store (Wine World, Emerald Spirits, Esquin, Downtown Spirits, etc.). Just some absolutely ridiculous pricing -- Kafkaesque almost.

Just remember, The Party Source usually runs a Cyber Monday deal for $15 flat shipping!

[NWBourbonDrinker]

What is this special at TPS? I have bought from them but always paid full shipping.

[dementedavenger]

What is this special at TPS? I have bought from them but always paid full shipping.

Last year on Black Friday or Cyber Monday, can't remember which one, they had $15.00, flat-rate shipping. I bought six 1.75L bottles and 9 750ml bottles and shipping was $15!

[NWBourbonDrinker]

Last year on Black Friday or Cyber Monday, can't remember which one, they had $15.00, flat-rate shipping. I bought six 1.75L bottles and 9 750ml bottles and shipping was $15!

Thanks I will have to watch this!

[WhiskyRI]

I travel to Seattle/Bellevue for work a couple of times a year. I'm frequently downtown and I've enjoyed visiting the Zig Zag café down the stairs from Pike's Place. Lots of good stuff on offer at reasonable prices. Plus once the staff know you actually know about whiskies they take care of you. Or at least that has been my experience on multiple visits. Ask for the whisky list and the "captain's list" as well. http://zigzagseattle.com/

[ChainWhip]

Theft problem since WA state got out of the retail business?

http://www.oregonlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2013/08/liquor_theft_soars_in_washingt.html

Could be drivel put out by the Oregon LCB, but the numbers are interesting.

[ChainWhip]

I too am curious why the same bottle costs $10 more in Washington at the same retailer before taxes are applied.

Look at the same chain's prices for Booker's in CA vs WA - another telling sign IMO. Curious indeed...

[NWBourbonDrinker]

Look at the same chain's prices for Booker's in CA vs WA - another telling sign IMO. Curious indeed...

Exactly. 20% higher in WA for the same bottle. Booker's is not the exception either.