Which one will fall next?

[bigmzungu]

5 minutes ago, meadeweber said:

Less than OWA?

Yes. That's what I was told by a store owner who does a lot of barrel picks. He said that's what BT told him.

[garbanzobean]

1 hour ago, bigmzungu said:

Yes. That's what I was told by a store owner who does a lot of barrel picks. He said that's what BT told him.

That's not a huge loss to me.  The OWA store picks I've had have been very good and sometimes even fairly unique, whereas the ER store picks I've tasted have been pretty disappointing.  Mostly they just taste like standard ER, and a couple have been pretty weak.

 

I have had some harsh words in the past for BT/Sazerac in regard to their removal of age statements in the past, but honestly NAS OWA has really improved in the past few years.  I doubt it's close to glut years Weller, but it's pretty darn good.

Edited December 27, 2016 by garbanzobean

[dSculptor]

On ‎12‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 8:51 AM, Limegoldconvertible68 said:

My question would be at 8 years old is it really Elijah Craig?  From my prospective one of the great things about EC12 was that it was at the long end of aging in oak. I would rather see a completely new product than continue changing the original. 

Totally agree!

[Clueby]

49 minutes ago, garbanzobean said:

That's not a huge loss to me.  The OWA store picks I've had have been very good and sometimes even fairly unique, whereas the ER store picks I've tasted have been pretty disappointing.  Mostly they just taste like standard ER, and a couple have been pretty weak.

 

I have had some harsh words in the past for BT/Sazerac in regard to their removal of age statements in the past, but honestly NAS OWA has really improved in the past few years.  I doubt it's close to glut years Weller, but it's pretty darn good.

Don't know that I've actually had a store pick ER.  The one I saw was $50 so I passed.  I've had some BT store pick SB and didn't think it was all that differrent from regular BT.  The OWA store picks I've had have all been excellent though.  I have a couple bottles of Binny's that are outstanding.  Really ramps up the flavor profile and some extra spiciness.

And on the ER losing its age statement..I didn't mean that 10 had moved to the back...just the 10 that IS on the back is a likely candidate for going away.  I'm aware of the bottling line changes that precipitated the neck band and single barrel designation changes.  Still think those things have helped "soften up" expectations.

[garbanzobean]

Unfortunately I am bracing for a lot more changes yet.  The only hope I'm clinging to at this point is that the bourbon industry has largely maintained acceptable to good QPR with our new NAS reality, whereas the scotch whisky industry has not.

[Kepler]

On 12/24/2016 at 0:47 PM, smokinjoe said:

Well, "close,  but no cigar.".  That is different than saying "same".  

I'll call you on that.  Semantics.  The key word in the quote was "maintain" which implies that they want to *continue* the same flavor, not *change* it.  Make sense?

 

For more support of that, just see Fred Minnick's article on EC12 when it went to NAS.  He quoted HH:

 

“We are trying to protect flavor profile of brand. We will have dumps closer to 11 to 12 {year-old barrels},” says master distiller Denny Potter. “We’ve been handcuffed a little bit because we can’t distribute like we want to. "

 

Most reasonable people take that to mean HH wants people to believe that they are trying to keep the flavor of the product the same, and not change it.  

[Limegoldconvertible68]

5 hours ago, Kepler said:

I'll call you on that.  Semantics.  The key word in the quote was "maintain" which implies that they want to *continue* the same flavor, not *change* it.  Make sense?

 

For more support of that, just see Fred Minnick's article on EC12 when it went to NAS.  He quoted HH:

 

“We are trying to protect flavor profile of brand. We will have dumps closer to 11 to 12 {year-old barrels},” says master distiller Denny Potter. “We’ve been handcuffed a little bit because we can’t distribute like we want to. "

 

Most reasonable people take that to mean HH wants people to believe that they are trying to keep the flavor of the product the same, and not change it.  

I haven't bought any of the NAS EC and I don't plan to. Ironically, if they are actually using dumps that are "closer to 11 to 12" I would be rather they just changed the label to EC10. Obviously I wasn't contacted by their marketing department because age statements are more important to me than "consistent flavor profile". Of course, in my opinion that phrase is nothing but a line of BS and my proof for that is the rise of single barrel offers which show the public is eager to buy a non consistent profile.  

[BigRich]

Unfortunately I am bracing for a lot more changes yet.  The only hope I'm clinging to at this point is that the bourbon industry has largely maintained acceptable to good QPR with our new NAS reality, whereas the scotch whisky industry has not.

You don't love all those watered down bland-to-flavorless overpriced single malts? Really? Go figure...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[smokinjoe]

7 hours ago, Kepler said:

I'll call you on that.  Semantics.  The key word in the quote was "maintain" which implies that they want to *continue* the same flavor, not *change* it.  Make sense?

 

For more support of that, just see Fred Minnick's article on EC12 when it went to NAS.  He quoted HH:

 

“We are trying to protect flavor profile of brand. We will have dumps closer to 11 to 12 {year-old barrels},” says master distiller Denny Potter. “We’ve been handcuffed a little bit because we can’t distribute like we want to. "

 

Most reasonable people take that to mean HH wants people to believe that they are trying to keep the flavor of the product the same, and not change it.  

 

Again, did not say "same".  Wording is important, here.  What is "not"said is as important as what "is" said.  

 

[garbanzobean]

18 minutes ago, BigRich said:

You don't love all those watered down bland-to-flavorless overpriced single malts? Really? Go figure...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You know I love me some scotchy scotch, but there are about 5 total distilleries I will accept NAS malts from.

[Whiskey Dick]

I'm down to the basic feeling that I don't care much anymore as long as HH6BIB and MGP rye stay in production. Between those and my bunker, I'm set for life.

[Jazz Nut]

As far as store selections of ER10 in the Minneapolis area, they usually go fast.  Ace Spirits has gotten a few in, and they usually only stay around for a month or two.  A few other stores have had store selects and they usually sell out in 6 months (G-Will, and France 44 come to mind).  I've not had a bad store selection, and they are usually as good or better than the normal bottling.  One in particular was tasty, great balance between oak, richness, and sweetness.  But I am forgetting which store selection it was.  All this talk about ER10, is making me want to taste through the available store selections in the area and get a bottle or two.  It's one of those bourbons that is easy to sip, or if you want, really analyze it.  It would be interesting to get the proof bumped up to maybe 100, or 110, to see if that adds a bit of impact.

[0895]

On 12/28/2016 at 6:57 PM, Jazz Nut said:

As far as store selections of ER10 in the Minneapolis area, they usually go fast.  Ace Spirits has gotten a few in, and they usually only stay around for a month or two.  A few other stores have had store selects and they usually sell out in 6 months (G-Will, and France 44 come to mind).  I've not had a bad store selection, and they are usually as good or better than the normal bottling.  One in particular was tasty, great balance between oak, richness, and sweetness.  But I am forgetting which store selection it was.  All this talk about ER10, is making me want to taste through the available store selections in the area and get a bottle or two.  It's one of those bourbons that is easy to sip, or if you want, really analyze it.  It would be interesting to get the proof bumped up to maybe 100, or 110, to see if that adds a bit of impact.

I think the Stagg JR is very close to what a barrel proof ER would taste like....just slightly younger than 10 year ?

[PaulO]

On 12/28/2016 at 7:31 AM, Limegoldconvertible68 said:

I haven't bought any of the NAS EC and I don't plan to. Ironically, if they are actually using dumps that are "closer to 11 to 12" I would be rather they just changed the label to EC10. Obviously I wasn't contacted by their marketing department because age statements are more important to me than "consistent flavor profile". Of course, in my opinion that phrase is nothing but a line of BS and my proof for that is the rise of single barrel offers which show the public is eager to buy a non consistent profile.  

I agree 100%.

To me, the 12 year age statement was the EC brand.  We've heard the mingle barrels of different ages for consistant profile story before.  (Looking at you Old Forester.) That's a good way to use up cats and dogs.  Send the honey barrels to some LE brand extension.

NAS EC might be ok for now, but no longer a premium brand that it was.

[mbroo5880i]

47 minutes ago, PaulO said:

I agree 100%.

To me, the 12 year age statement was the EC brand.  We've heard the mingle barrels of different ages for consistant profile story before.  (Looking at you Old Forester.) That's a good way to use up cats and dogs.  Send the honey barrels to some LE brand extension.

NAS EC might be ok for now, but no longer a premium brand that it was.

 

I have fully expected to see EC 12 reappear at some point with a significant price increase.  My guess is in the future EC NAS will be $25 MSRP, EC 12 $ 45-50 MSRP and EC BP $70-75 MSRP.   They brought back EC 18 and we saw what they did there.

[dcbt]

3 hours ago, mbroo5880i said:

 

I have fully expected to see EC 12 reappear at some point with a significant price increase.

This has been rumored for almost as long as EC went NAS. I think breakingbourbon still lists it under the rumors section (which usually seem to come true btw).

[mbroo5880i]

3 hours ago, dcbt said:

This has been rumored for almost as long as EC went NAS. I think breakingbourbon still lists it under the rumors section (which usually seem to come true btw).

 

Yeah, I have seen discussion in this forum previously too and it seems to make sense.  I can see there being some product differentiation similar to CEHT SmB, SiB and BP.  Hopefully, the prices won't end up in the same ranges.

[Jazz Nut]

9 hours ago, 0895 said:

I think the Stagg JR is very close to what a barrel proof ER would taste like....just slightly younger than 10 year ?

Good point!!  I might try a blend of ER10 and Stagg JR. to see how things turn out.

[mbroo5880i]

9 minutes ago, Jazz Nut said:

Good point!!  I might try a blend of ER10 and Stagg JR. to see how things turn out.

 

I have only purchased one bottle of Stagg Jr.  I blended it with BT and it closely matched the CEHT SmB profile.

[flahute]

2 hours ago, Jazz Nut said:

Good point!!  I might try a blend of ER10 and Stagg JR. to see how things turn out.

I've been blending Stagg Jr. with VOB6, BT, and ER10 for years now. In the early days, it was to smooth out the rough edges in the Stagg Jr. Now that Stagg Jr. stands on it's own quite nicely it's not really necessary but I still like to blend with ER10 as a way of proofing down the Jr. while adding a bit of the elegance that the extra age from ER10 brings to the blend. Very good.

[Wedelstaedt]

1 hour ago, flahute said:

I've been blending Stagg Jr. with VOB6, BT, and ER10 for years now. In the early days, it was to smooth out the rough edges in the Stagg Jr. Now that Stagg Jr. stands on it's own quite nicely it's not really necessary but I still like to blend with ER10 as a way of proofing down the Jr. while adding a bit of the elegance that the extra age from ER10 brings to the blend. Very good.

Flahute,
 

Do you mind sharing the ratio of Stagg Jr. to ER10 you prefer in your blendings?

 

Thanks in advance,

 

Wedel

[flahute]

14 minutes ago, Wedelstaedt said:

Flahute,
 

Do you mind sharing the ratio of Stagg Jr. to ER10 you prefer in your blendings?

 

Thanks in advance,

 

Wedel

I'm afraid to say that it's always been very unscientific for me. My palate changes from day to day so my perception of "heat" from the alcohol content dictates how much down proofing I need to do on any given day. I generally start with a slightly less than normal size pour of Jr. and add a small amount of ER10 and then taste to see what happens. It's either good to go right there or I need to add more. If I had to guess, I'd say it's likely 70:30 Stagg Jr. to ER10. (But sometimes it's likely closer to 80:20)

[Wedelstaedt]

Thank you Steve,

 

Good information for me, because I had it in my head closer to 60:40.  This could've been a waste to good bourbon.  :-(

[flahute]

9 hours ago, Wedelstaedt said:

Thank you Steve,

 

Good information for me, because I had it in my head closer to 60:40.  This could've been a waste to good bourbon.  :-(

In that case, you only need to add more Jr. back in! Not a waste at all.

[tanstaafl2]

On ‎12‎/‎24‎/‎2016 at 10:37 AM, bourbontiger9 said:

I agree, it 100% comes down to supply and demand for the juice. For sake of discussion though, why couldn't they keep EC12, HMcK10 BIB, ER10 and just start marketing and selling a younger version of product at a lower cost? This essentially gets back to us paying for the age statements mentioned earlier in the thread, but it seems an option like this would keep all parties happy, possibly? Thoughts?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

You have a better chance of seeing an NAS version come out at the current cost and MAYBE seeing an age stated version at a new higher cost in limited quantities.

 

Speaking of which aren't we about due for the return of EC12 at its new higher price???

Edited January 6, 2017 by tanstaafl2
I see someone has already gone there in this thread!