The types of "Flippers" or is there even a difference?

[garbanzobean]

I figure the limited release market is too crowded by a couple orders of magnitude.  Best to take myself out of it.  I love having a variety of flavors available to me, so I drink a variety of spirits.  In this day and age, it makes a lot of sense to be a generalist (a liquor omnivore, if you will) instead of a specialist.  So I guess that makes me a boozehound instead of a bourbonsaurus.  So in this analogy, flippers would be the comet.

 

Then again, bourbon is pretty awesome, and so are dinosaurs.  If only the two interests could be combined . . .

Edited August 1, 2016 by garbanzobean

[Masset1982]

Do you consider auction as a secondary market ? Cause, if i want to taste some of the LE, i have no other choice than auction. I'm a big fan of George T Stagg, but i've never seen it on a shelve or online available at retail. 

 

 

On 24/12/2015 at 1:06 AM, beasled said:

Urgh. Someone I follow on Twitter that I share tipoffs with is actively buying multiples of FRsmbLE 15 that have now been 'tucked away for trades'... That's one tip I feel bad for sharing...

I'm drinking my bottle of FRsmbLE 2015

 

[b1gcountry]

Auctions are definitely secondary market

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[beasled]

4 hours ago, Masset1982 said:

Do you consider auction as a secondary market ? Cause, if i want to taste some of the LE, i have no other choice than auction. I'm a big fan of George T Stagg, but i've never seen it on a shelve or online available at retail. 

 

 

I'm drinking my bottle of FRsmbLE 2015

 

 

Good man! I assume you know I didn't mean you

[PaulO]

Masset 1982 is in Belgium, so he can legally purchase by mail liquor from all over the EU.  I'm not sure, but the auctions may be legal there too.  

[Masset1982]

Ok, secondary market it is, but like i said, i don't have many options when it comes to buy some LE (mostly BTAC). I was able to get a WLW 2015 at "european retail prices" €162 with delivery. Trust me if a could get it at retail i'll be happy.

 

2 hours ago, beasled said:

 

Good man! I assume you know I didn't mean you

Of course.

Have a nice evening.

[b1gcountry]

Ok, secondary market it is, but like i said, i don't have many options when it comes to buy some LE (mostly BTAC). I was able to get a WLW 2015 at "european retail prices" €162 with delivery. Trust me if a could get it at retail i'll be happy.

 

Of course.[emoji6]

Have a nice evening.

I do not judge anyone buying from the secondary market, even in the US. If you are in Europe I imagine the selection is much more limited.

[Tony Santana]

38 minutes ago, b1gcountry said:

I do not judge anyone buying from the secondary market, even in the US. If you are in Europe I imagine the selection is much more limited.

 

Oh hell, I judge.  I can understand, but there's still some judgment in there.

[Masset1982]

10 hours ago, b1gcountry said:

I do not judge anyone buying from the secondary market, even in the US. If you are in Europe I imagine the selection is much more limited.

You're right, we don't have a large selection of LE where i live.

 

These are the brands available at the only liquor store that we have :  

 

Jack Daniel's (Silver Select, SB, Gentleman, Honey, Sinitra Select)

Jim Beam (White Label, Black Label 12 yo Signature Craft)

Blanton's (Green, SB, Gold, SFTB)

Eagle Rare 101

Wild Turkey - 8yo

Woodford Reserve

Eljah Craig 12yo

Four Roses (Yellow Edition)

Knob Creek 9 yo

Elmer T Lee (out of stock for two years now)

Weller 12 (out of stock for more than two years)

Bulleit (Regular, Rye)

 

*Don't get me wrong, these are good ones. 

 

No BTAC, no Four Roses LE, no Pappy (i don't mind), no WFE, no CEHT, no barrel proof (except Blanton's which his not always available), i can go on and on. So i have to purschase online or in auctions to get the top shelve stuff which mean paying high prices.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[b1gcountry]

Well, most of us here can't get any BTAC, Pappy, or 4RLE either. I actually have trouble getting any HWMWND in the St Louis market.

Also, plenty of the selections you listed are top shelf bourbon. It doesn't have to be limited to be awesome.

[Masset1982]

Yeah, i know, but i like having something special (rare, hard to find) in my cabinet, so i can share it with family and friends. 

 

By the way, what is HWMWND ?

 

 

[garbanzobean]

I have zero issues with legal secondary markets.  I am a little jealous that they don't really exist in the U.S., but about all I can do about that is vote with my dollars and not participate in the liquor black market.

[garbanzobean]

2 minutes ago, Masset1982 said:

Yeah, i know, but i like having something special (rare, hard to find) in my cabinet, so i can share it with family and friends. 

 

By the way, what is HWMWND ?

 

 

High West Midwinter Night's Dram.  Based on the fact that Glemorangie is using the exact same name for a product of theirs, I'm going to assume it is not sold outside of the U.S.

[garbanzobean]

I view legal secondary markets about the same as I view derivatives markets.  Don't love 'em, can't do anything about them, banning them is pointless/unlikely to have desired effect/does more harm than good.

[Masset1982]

First time i've heard of it, it seems pretty limited to. I just watched Matt from Big Red Liquor doing a review about it on Youtube, it must be nice. i'm not crazy about rye whiskey, a pour from time to time.

You're assuming right, it's not sold in EU.

 

Living in Europe, i'd rather switch to scotch or irish whisky, it's easier to find, but i like bourbon so much.

 

 

[Hop]

Just ran into the "store owner" flipper this week who admits he puts the product out at a "high" price to see if there is interest (like ETL @ $150)  then when someone asks or seems interested he may offer up something else he has behind the counter - I told him I wasn't interested in secondary prices but he continued to talk anyway and admitted to selling on Ebay as well.  Also he said he puts out a bottle of the current batch of something like Stagg Jr like he had on the shelf for $80 but holds back the older batches so he can sell them at higher prices... DOUCHE!

[ThirstyinOhio]

  I don't like flippers, especially those who are in it strictly for the money and don't even like bourbon but I am part of the problem.  I have bought numerous bottles on the secondary market because it was the only way for me to get them.  These include long out of production bottles, export only, and some limited release types.  I have two choices, give up the hopes/dreams of tasting some of these items or simply pay what this market demands, I have chosen the later.  I am obsessed with bourbon and rye and fortunately am lucky to afford this hobby even with the crazed prices.  However, I have never sold a bottle for profit and have frequently sold bottles for even less than I paid for them or simply gave them away to friends, including a few on here and will share anything I have when people come over.  I got started in this hobby when a friend dragged me to a bourbon dinner and now I repay that kindness by sharing great whiskey with others.  if I have to swim with the sharks to get interesting bottles, so be it.

 

 To respond more directly to the OP, anyone that gains materially by reselling a bottle is a flipper to me.  If one trades for bottles at equal "retail" values, then I wouldn't consider them a flipper.  Either way, I'll buy from anyone/anywhere if it gets me what I want.

Edited August 3, 2016 by ThirstyinOhio

[ThirstyinOhio]

 I realize that my above post might make me sound like a bourbon snob or an a-hole, so let me clarify.  I drink a wide variety of bourbon with my current every day favorites being Rare Breed, EHTBP, and HIH BP, but I like trying new whiskies as much as possible. 

[Richnimrod]

3 hours ago, ThirstyinOhio said:

  I don't like flippers, especially those who are in it strictly for the money and don't even like bourbon but I am part of the problem.  I have bought numerous bottles on the secondary market because it was the only way for me to get them.  These include long out of production bottles, export only, and some limited release types.  I have two choices, give up the hopes/dreams of tasting some of these items or simply pay what this market demands, I have chosen the later.  I am obsessed with bourbon and rye and fortunately am lucky to afford this hobby even with the crazed prices.  However, I have never sold a bottle for profit and have frequently sold bottles for even less than I paid for them or simply gave them away to friends, including a few on here and will share anything I have when people come over.  I got started in this hobby when a friend dragged me to a bourbon dinner and now I repay that kindness by sharing great whiskey with others.  if I have to swim with the sharks to get interesting bottles, so be it.

 

 To respond more directly to the OP, anyone that gains materially by reselling a bottle is a flipper to me.  If one trades for bottles at equal "retail" values, then I wouldn't consider them a flipper.  Either way, I'll buy from anyone/anywhere if it gets me what I want.

At least you recognize that you are indeed part of the problem.   Better than that (IMHO) would be to not participate (as I do not).    I fully realize that means denying myself the experiences of those LE's for which I don't have retail opportunities, as I have done on many occasions in order to not be part of the problem.     This is, of course my own personal choice, and makes extremely little impact on the ledger of the secondary (black) market(s); but at least I'm sure I'm not contributing on the 'wrong' side of said ledger.     All that said; I do not judge anybody else upon the decisions they make with their own money or their own bottles, and it sounds to me like you are a kind, sharing and generous person with your bottles.

[fishnbowljoe]

I've never traded or sold/flipped a bottle for a profit. That is, until yesterday. 

 

I have a friend at work that enjoys a few different spirits. As far as bourbon goes, he likes BT and WT 101. We traded samples last week. I gave him a sample of HH 6 BIB, and he gave me a sample of Costco's Canadian Whiskey. He really liked the HH 6, so I told him that I'd be willing to part with a bottle. He took delivery yesterday. I told him that with tax, title and license, it came out to around $13.00. He thanked me, gave me a knowing smile and wink, then handed me $15.00 and told me to keep the change. 

 

Cheers! Joe

[Richnimrod]

56 minutes ago, fishnbowljoe said:

I've never traded or sold/flipped a bottle for a profit. That is, until yesterday. 

 

I have a friend at work that enjoys a few different spirits. As far as bourbon goes, he likes BT and WT 101. We traded samples last week. I gave him a sample of HH 6 BIB, and he gave me a sample of Costco's Canadian Whiskey. He really liked the HH 6, so I told him that I'd be willing to part with a bottle. He took delivery yesterday. I told him that with tax, title and license, it came out to around $13.00. He thanked me, gave me a knowing smile and wink, then handed me $15.00 and told me to keep the change. 

 

Cheers! Joe

JOE!!!!    You?   Say it ain't so!    My good buddy become a flipper... FOR PROFIT!!!!    Omigawd!

[b1gcountry]

Ban yourself!

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[GaryT]

9 hours ago, fishnbowljoe said:

I've never traded or sold/flipped a bottle for a profit. That is, until yesterday. 

 

I have a friend at work that enjoys a few different spirits. As far as bourbon goes, he likes BT and WT 101. We traded samples last week. I gave him a sample of HH 6 BIB, and he gave me a sample of Costco's Canadian Whiskey. He really liked the HH 6, so I told him that I'd be willing to part with a bottle. He took delivery yesterday. I told him that with tax, title and license, it came out to around $13.00. He thanked me, gave me a knowing smile and wink, then handed me $15.00 and told me to keep the change. 

 

Cheers! Joe

 

That's how it starts . . . now the next guy tries it and says "$15?!?!  I'll give you $20 for one of them!"  

 

Before you know it, you're turning $13 bottles of HH 6 on a street corner for fiddy, and avoiding eye contact with grandmas as they walk past casting judgement.

 

Or, on second thought . . . maybe that's all hype   

[Flyfish]

I think I've told this story before: My friend Bill worked at a state liquor store in a "questionable" part of town to help pay for school. He says he had a regular customer who came in every Sat. evening and bought a car trunk load of booze. Eventually the customer explained that the booze was for his "clients" who were too stupid to stock up for Sunday when liquor could not be sold legally. He just doubled the price and had no problem from his clients who appreciated the service. Certainly it was illegal but guys who gulp their booze neat from bottles in paper bags are not likely to press charges. 

Edited August 4, 2016 by Flyfish

[PaulO]

Neither are people under 21 years old .