About All Things Pappy/VanWinkle

[scubadoo97]

The benchmark bottles that people are paying cagilions or are harder to find then the Dead Sea scrolls are never worth the lifetime trek to obtain. I was once in line for a grateful dead concert in 1992 and some idiot wanted to buy my ticket for 5 times what I paid. For a moment I was tempted but after the show started...

Just have fun and make (and keep) friends. You will have everything you need. And it's all right here if you look at it right.

GREAT advice and should be taken to heart.

[damackaroni]

I appreciate the advice fellas. I'm eventually planning on visiting KY with some friends this summer, so I'm sure I'll pick up a couple decent bottles (outside of the PVW stuff) that I can't get down here in FL.

I've been trying to track down a bottle of WL Antique everywhere, but it is sold out in every store, or they don't carry it. I have (3) bottles of WL Weller 12 yr, and (1) bottle of WL Weller Special Reserve 7 yr already in the cabinet. Really enjoying those two. Those are readily available in Central Florida thank goodness. Most store clerks down here don't even know the significance behind the Weller 12 yr, so they look confused when you ask for it, and honestly, I'd like to keep it that way. Keep the ignorant as they are in this situation. When I see people selling Weller 12 yr online for $150, it does scare me a little that one day, even Weller 12 will be a goose chase.

The problem is, everything can't just be a good product these days. It has to be a "collectible". People buying something and then sticking it in their closet to collect dust. I don't get it (unless of course by doing that it improves the product, like wine). I love my Jordan basketball shoes too, and when I wear them to play in on the weekends, people look at me and say, "You're playing in those?? You're going to ruin them!".... Pappy has become the Jordan Basketball Shoes of Bourbon. I just want to try them on for size if I have the opportunity :-)

So I guess if I'm lucky enough to stumble upon a clerk that will give me a phone call, or a store that has a bottle hidden in the back, then lovely, I might just take it. However, based on what people have said on this board, as well as what my bartending friends have told me, PVW is an excellent bourbon, but it's not worth losing sleepover. I get it, I really do. I'm just intrigued I guess.

[The Black Tot]

Looks like Florida is the new Texas.

[damackaroni]

Looks like Florida is the new Texas.

It's pretty bad. Best bottles I've seen are a Eagle Rare 17 yr (2005) for $450, WTAS (2008) for $200, and WP Boss Hog $180.

I was told today while picking up a bottle of Willet Rye that a couple stores are starting waiting lists for ORVW 10 yr at $500 a bottle, and RVW 12 yr Lot B for $700... this is being sold in retail stores at those prices and people are lining up. I told the guy, "I don't even want to add my name to that list of idiots. I'll go pick up some Weller 12 when I need it."

I mean, I suppose if money is not an issue, then do what you want. But it's all relative. I'm more than happy to join the lotteries each fall, or make a phone call to the couple listed distributors down here. But I'm not willing to pay 16x the price for a bottle of Lot B over a bottle of Weller 12 yr when they come from the same mashbill, and are being separated out for being marginally better.

[fishnbowljoe]

Just a heads up here. I'm doing a little cross posting, with a little addition on the end. The first part below is from another thread.

Pappy. Well, the Van Winkle stuff has changed a bit over the last number of years. I've tried them all. I have multiple bottles of all but the Pappy 23. I've pretty much liked them all but the Pappy 23. Like the EC 18, too much wood and char flavor in the Pappy 23 for me. I prefer wheated bourbons, and the Pappy stuff is wheated. What can I say? Still, I'm not sure whether I'll ever buy any more Pappy or not. Yes, price and availability are contributing factors. The big deal about Pappy used to be the fact that it was Stitzel Weller distillate. Now, with the possible exception of the Pappy 23, (maybe the Pappy 20 too) it all comes from BT. There's no comparison at all. Both good. Both different. Both worth the cost???? You have to try them if you can, and make your own decision there.

We're our own worst enemies when it comes to the Van Winkle offerings. We have helped to propagate the Pappy "myth" so to speak. We have helped make Pappy into an icon, despite the fact that it isn't what it used to be. The flippers and folks on other private sites that are only interested in making a buck are probably loving people and sites like us because we're helping them make money. Julian and Preston probably aren't displeased either. If you look at it in a broad sense, we're doing so at our own expense. Can't find any Pappy. Why? Other people have bought it all. Why's that? We've said it's the best bourbon you can buy. Go figure. :soapbox:

The other part of the Pappy puzzle is part fact, and part conjecture on my part.

The fact part is the Van Winkle bottlings are now being distributed more widely. There are now stores getting VW stuff, that in the past hadn't ever received any before. (At least one store that I know of didn't even order any last year, but received some nonetheless.) This means that stores that used to get a decent allotment of VW's, are now getting less. Another fact is that more restaurants/bars are getting VW too. So, stores that have already seen their order/allotment of VW's diminish, are now having their orders cut even further.

Now for the conjecture part. I posted two or three years ago that I had heard that Sazerac had let a number of their long time sales reps go. A couple of other members here had noticed and/or heard the same thing. Relationships between reps and stores that had grown and been cultivated over the years, no longer mattered as much. I'm sure that many stores retained somewhat of a favored status, but not quite like they had enjoyed before. The way I see it, they spread out the wealth, and leveled the playing field. Even though things had already started going downhill with the VW's, (and the BTAC too) after this happened, it seems that things really started getting crazy. It's only gotten worse since. The timing of it all just seems odd to me. Conjecture, or conspiracy theory? :skep: Probably just coincidence, but still.....

[garbanzobean]

I don't think you're far off. Seems like 2012 or 2013 was when things really went nuts in Maryland. But theres a bit of a difference between here and a lot of other places. There's so much money in the DC metro area. So much. And so many favors to be bought. As such, this area is extremely trend sensitive (so you can add Yamazaki to the list of whiskies that aren't available here anymore with regularity). On the bright side, trend sensitive areas are often the first to recover so I think we'll start seeing the VW/BTAC stuff on shelves again earlier than some places.

[whiskeyscope]

I think 2013 was the year that it truly was damn near impossible to track down a bottle. In 2012 and before, I could get it with just a little homework. Even in 2011, I walked into a store that had about 20 bottles of VWFRR behind the counter (it was a sight to behold). Limit 1, of course, but I still got 1. I made a foolish mistake in 2011 passing on the ORVW23 decanter set for $350. I balked at that price. Was only able to get the ORVW10 in 2013 and 2014. But I'm fine with that. I can still go get the stuff at the restaurant if I really had to have it. The hunt is still fun as long as I know where to draw the line.

That being said, I've enjoyed them all and find them worthy of the hype. You all know the rest of the story. Just dropping my 2 cents.

[garbanzobean]

I would like to try a pour of the tanked versions of VWFRR and Saz 18. Other than that, I am very much at peace with what is available to me. Worst case scenario, I pay stupid bar prices for a pour of each and consider it a once in a lifetime expenditure.

[Old Dusty]

I would like to try a pour of the tanked versions of VWFRR and Saz 18. Other than that, I am very much at peace with what is available to me. Worst case scenario, I pay stupid bar prices for a pour of each and consider it a once in a lifetime expenditure.

Go for an older bottle of VW if you truly want to be sure of getting the Medley/Bernheim mix. Rumor/scuttlebutt etc has BT mixing its own rye into the last few dumps. No idea if true (or if true for how long or in what percentage). It will, though convert to all BT if it hasn't already. Also this is the last year for the tanked Saz18. It will be BT in 2016. Hoping they release this last tanked version at full strength.

[dSculptor]

I missed out on my favs this past yr: Saz18 and the WLW, managed to snag me a ER17, and a GTS, hope that changes this yr.

[The Black Tot]

Also this is the last year for the tanked Saz18. It will be BT in 2016. Hoping they release this last tanked version at full strength.

[TXNewDude]

I thought this was amusing.

I stopped by a small local store just to check things out. They've only been open a year.

I was the only one in there so the manager ask if I needed help. I said I was just checking to see if there happened to be any rare/limited bourbons. She said no, sorry, but that there was a time last year when some guy walked in to look at the bourbons.

She asked if she could help and he said he doesn't think she can help him with what he's looking for. She proceeded to ask what and he replied something called Pappy. Lady had a bottle behind the counter! She said the man's jaw dropped and said "What!" in amazement.

If you're in the SB community and you picked one up last year from a local shop in Plano, TX, say hi! lol

[Mr. Bourbon]

Looks like i can drive 2 hours and get a bottle of this, Have to fill out a form first!

*

NB Liquor would like to offer you the chance to purchase one (1) of three (3) available bottles of Pappy Van Winkle.

Please fill out the following to be entered for the draw taking place on April 24th 2015. Three (3) names will be drawn for the chance to purchase a bottle of Pappy Van Winkle.

*Winners will be announced and notified by phone or email.

I'm sure it's good, But is it $350 good?

Edited March 31, 2015 by Mr. Bourbon

[Chris m]

No

edit: I like the "sought by hundreds the world over" line.

[Zeke]

Howdy!

I'm sure it's good, But is it $350 good?

Given the state of the Canadian dollar and the MSRP, it's at least $318.17 good.

I'm wondering where the other 27 end up, and how they are going to be sold...

[jwes1776]

Saw these three bottles today:

Pappy 10 -- $279

Pappy 23-- $1999

Whistle Pig Boss Hog--$179

Any of these even worth looking at at these prices?

[CorvallisCracker]

Saw these three bottles today:

Pappy 10 -- $279

Pappy 23-- $1999

Whistle Pig Boss Hog--$179

Any of these even worth looking at at these prices?

Sure, but only until you feel your eyes start to cross.

[tanstaafl2]

Saw these three bottles today:

Pappy 10 -- $279

Pappy 23-- $1999

Whistle Pig Boss Hog--$179

Any of these even worth looking at at these prices?

The Top Pig is the closest to its MSRP. I think the newest one with "Mortimer" the pig on the cap was priced around that level from the start. Which only means it is grossly overpriced to begin with. :shithappens:

[squire]

In my view no, I wouldn't even stop to look at those prices.

[Richnimrod]

In my view no, I wouldn't even stop to look at those prices.

ABSOLUTELY!!! What he said. Don't encourage the gougers!

[jwes1776]

Yeah, the whistle pig gave me pause, but I ended up with a mckenna bib for $30.

[Harry in WashDC]

Yeah, the whistle pig gave me pause, but I ended up with a mckenna bib for $30.

[DBM]

Saw these three bottles today:

Pappy 10 -- $279

Pappy 23-- $1999

Whistle Pig Boss Hog--$179

Any of these even worth looking at at these prices?

I may have bought the WP Boss Hog, assuming it's the new Mortimer bottling. I'm slowing getting over my annoyance with WP for their NDP overpriced rye - I hate the price, but when I drink some, it's pretty top notch. IMO it's better than Handy, and if Handy was on a shelf for $179 it would be gone quickly in most regions.

[TunnelTiger]

Both of the older boss hogs are $199 at my main store.

Since he hasn't sold a bottle of either in the past year I bet he doesn't put Mortimer on the shelf. (std WP is $99)

[squire]

Since he hasn't sold a bottle of either in the past year I bet he doesn't put Mortimer on the shelf. (std WP is $99)

And the standard whisky in WP is available for a lot less under other labels just as the standard whisky sold under Van Winkle brands costs a lot less when bottled as Weller.