Empty Bottle(s) Support Group ~ 2020

[CardsandBourbon]

11 minutes ago, Old Dusty said:

I’m just a guy on the Internet with no inside info, but Luxco and HH have a decades long relationship dating back to the David Sherman company that Luxco acquired IIRC. So unless it’s Luxco’s own it is very likely HH. And as far as I know HH only has one wheated mashbill but they could certainly be contract distilling a different one for Lux. 

I'm not saying it is or isn't HH, just that it didn't taste anything like the older bottle of Old Fitz BIB I also have.  Seeing as it's not age stated and was just recently released I'm thinking it might be Luxco's own distillate.  But like you I don't have any inside info either.

[Old Dusty]

Can say with certainty that I was impressed w Lux Row distillery. Got to chat with the Lux family who happened to walk in on our tasting. Very nice folks with a clear passion for the industry. After being (very successful) NDPs they were giddy to be up and running in their own facility. 

[HoustonNit]

Well guys one less person out there looking for Stagg Jr., just not a fan. This batch 10 was certainly better than my last one, batch 5 but I won’t be a repeat buyer.

[flahute]

5 hours ago, CardsandBourbon said:

I'm not saying it is or isn't HH, just that it didn't taste anything like the older bottle of Old Fitz BIB I also have.  Seeing as it's not age stated and was just recently released I'm thinking it might be Luxco's own distillate.  But like you I don't have any inside info either.

My math may be a bit foggy but I'm pretty sure Luxco's still hasn't been running long enough for them to have anything ready to bottle unless what you have is really young.

[CUfan99]

On 1/23/2020 at 10:22 PM, Kepler said:

I need to open mine soon to give it a whirl.  But mine isn't a barrel pick unfortunately. 

A dad’s drinking bourbon podcast guest who had multiple PS Weller FP’s was of the opinion that the standard FP was better. He credited it to being a batched product that just happened to be batched by BT. They’ve proven to be pretty good blenders <understatement>. The PS SiBs are chosen by ?????

[Richnimrod]

1 hour ago, CUfan99 said:

 The PS SiBs are chosen by ?????

^^^^THIS^^^^ is the reason that private pix . . . of anything, can be great . . . Or not! 

One must be wary about the current trend extolling any and every bottle on offer just because it's a private pick.   

Just my opinion, of course; but I've been disappointed by about as many as I've liked and at least twice as many as I've loved, back when I'd take flyers on 'em.

The best advice I've heard about private selection decisions is this: Try Before You Buy (unless you're very sure about the picker(s) skill, and their palates align with yours in a substantial way).

[JCwhammie]

27 minutes ago, Richnimrod said:

The best advice I've heard about private selection decisions is this: Try Before You Buy (unless you're very sure about the picker(s) skill, and their palates align with yours in a substantial way).

And even then the pickers are at the mercy of the barrels they're allowed to sample. A few days ago I was speaking with the whiskey manager at a place that's had some tasty picks. He stated one particular brand was sending 2 barrels for this market. A different store chose which one they wanted, so this store had the option of accepting the other barrel or not getting any. He went ahead and bought the barrel. 

[CUfan99]

1 hour ago, Richnimrod said:

^^^^THIS^^^^ is the reason that private pix . . . of anything, can be great . . . Or not! 

One must be wary about the current trend extolling any and every bottle on offer just because it's a private pick.   

Just my opinion, of course; but I've been disappointed by about as many as I've liked and at least twice as many as I've loved, back when I'd take flyers on 'em.

The best advice I've heard about private selection decisions is this: Try Before You Buy (unless you're very sure about the picker(s) skill, and their palates align with yours in a substantial way).

Yep. When I’m weighing buying a PS from somewhere I know nothing about I always consider the shelf version first. Is it a single barrel product? If so I’ll always go with the PS. If it’s a blended product like BT or 1792 BiB I’ll almost always pass on the unknown PS. 

[Clueby]

The last month or so of empties. 

[FacePlant]

On 1/30/2020 at 7:28 AM, Richnimrod said:

^^^^THIS^^^^ is the reason that private pix . . . of anything, can be great . . . Or not! 

One must be wary about the current trend extolling any and every bottle on offer just because it's a private pick.   

Just my opinion, of course; but I've been disappointed by about as many as I've liked and at least twice as many as I've loved, back when I'd take flyers on 'em.

The best advice I've heard about private selection decisions is this: Try Before You Buy (unless you're very sure about the picker(s) skill, and their palates align with yours in a substantial way).

Words of wisdom Rich. I went to a pick yesterday where we planned on getting up to four barrels. Bought one good one and one it think might be excellent. The other triple samples were not (in my opinion) up to putting the LS label on. It was not the first pass for this group either. There are plenty of barrels out there with even more on the way. Some new players are also coming on so you really don't need to push those SiB picks unless it's discernibly better than the standard batches. Certain taters might buy any SPs but your true bourbon customers want those honey barrel choices if possible. 

[Richnimrod]

4 hours ago, FacePlant said:

Words of wisdom Rich. I went to a pick yesterday where we planned on getting up to four barrels. Bought one good one and one it think might be excellent. The other triple samples were not (in my opinion) up to putting the LS label on. It was not the first pass for this group either. There are plenty of barrels out there with even more on the way. Some new players are also coming on so you really don't need to push those SiB picks unless it's discernibly better than the standard batches. Certain taters might buy any SPs but your true bourbon customers want those honey barrel choices if possible. 

Ah, that's good,   You should always be prepared to walk away if there aren't any barrels among your selection options that at least very good.    Your point about seeking something that is certainly better than the shelf offerings of the brand, is a good way to look at it as well.

[Skinsfan1311]

New Riff .  So much bang for the buck.

[Jazz June]

On 1/30/2020 at 8:28 AM, Richnimrod said:

^^^^THIS^^^^ is the reason that private pix . . . of anything, can be great . . . Or not! 

One must be wary about the current trend extolling any and every bottle on offer just because it's a private pick.   

Just my opinion, of course; but I've been disappointed by about as many as I've liked and at least twice as many as I've loved, back when I'd take flyers on 'em.

The best advice I've heard about private selection decisions is this: Try Before You Buy (unless you're very sure about the picker(s) skill, and their palates align with yours in a substantial way).

I think this is a good thing to keep in mind as every online barrel pick group hypes the hell out of their picks. At least some of this is clearly for the purpose of flipping their bottles for profit.

 

Also, in the good old days, the distilleries could probably afford to pull and/or hold aside particularly good barrels for the few groups doing these picks. Now with inventories being stretched so thin and so many groups begging for picks, I too am doubtful that anywhere near all of the privately selected barrels are in any way special.

 

There are some types of picks that have no standard product equivalent (Four Roses, Old Forester, arguably Maker's Mark, special barrel finishes, etc.), so ok those are special in some way. I still generally pick up any Four Roses pick I see at a reasonable price, but I'm not sure this is a good idea anymore. Beyond that, is the group/store/person who picked a particular barrel (likely from limited options) going to do a better job than the professionals at the distilleries (for a single barrel) or pick something better than a batched product whose profile can be controlled better through the use of many barrels? I don't buy it. If you know a store/group/person or they at least have a solid reputation for good picks, then sure. But picks have gone from one of the hidden/unknown/under-appreciated good values in bourbon to over-hyped and over-priced (just like so many other things in bourbonia). But pick groups will always have one of the best things about bourbon going for them - other bourbon loving people to enjoy your bourbon with. So in that respect, they are great

[flahute]

17 minutes ago, Jazz June said:

I think this is a good thing to keep in mind as every online barrel pick group hypes the hell out of their picks. At least some of this is clearly for the purpose of flipping their bottles for profit.

 

Also, in the good old days, the distilleries could probably afford to pull and/or hold aside particularly good barrels for the few groups doing these picks. Now with inventories being stretched so thin and so many groups begging for picks, I too am doubtful that anywhere near all of the privately selected barrels are in any way special.

 

There are some types of picks that have no standard product equivalent (Four Roses, Old Forester, arguably Maker's Mark, special barrel finishes, etc.), so ok those are special in some way. I still generally pick up any Four Roses pick I see at a reasonable price, but I'm not sure this is a good idea anymore. Beyond that, is the group/store/person who picked a particular barrel (likely from limited options) going to do a better job than the professionals at the distilleries (for a single barrel) or pick something better than a batched product whose profile can be controlled better through the use of many barrels? I don't buy it. If you know a store/group/person or they at least have a solid reputation for good picks, then sure. But picks have gone from one of the hidden/unknown/under-appreciated good values in bourbon to over-hyped and over-priced (just like so many other things in bourbonia). But pick groups will always have one of the best things about bourbon going for them - other bourbon loving people to enjoy your bourbon with. So in that respect, they are great

I am in one of those groups and I can tell you that sometimes we get particularly good barrels set aside and sometimes we don't. I depends on the distillery and how long our relationship with them has been.

You are correct to be skeptical of most of these groups. Not every group is willing to walk away if none of the barrels are up to their standards. Our group is and in fact we walked away from a Larceny barrel pick last November. Our group also has a 1 year moratorium from selling any of our picks because we don't want to be seen as profit seeking flippers. Most of us want to drink ours anyway.

[Jazz June]

1 hour ago, flahute said:

I am in one of those groups and I can tell you that sometimes we get particularly good barrels set aside and sometimes we don't. I depends on the distillery and how long our relationship with them has been.

You are correct to be skeptical of most of these groups. Not every group is willing to walk away if none of the barrels are up to their standards. Our group is and in fact we walked away from a Larceny barrel pick last November. Our group also has a 1 year moratorium from selling any of our picks because we don't want to be seen as profit seeking flippers. Most of us want to drink ours anyway.

I think the long-standing relationships and willingness to walk away if nothing great is available are two hallmarks of a pick group that would consistently have good picks. I've read/heard enough comments from the distillery folks to know that at least some of them still really value the people that were supporting them before it was cool. I mean at one point, they could barely give the stuff away (Van Winkle picks? can't imagine the bust that would have to happen for that to ever be a thing again).

 

If a group/store has been consistently doing picks since before the boom, then I can definitely believe that some of the distilleries go the extra mile to hook them up. At the end of the day, there aren't that many legacy distilleries and there aren't that many people involved, so it's a relatively small industry. It's also one that remembers the bad times and the customers who were loyal during those bad times. It's part of why I think the distilleries and stores that are taking maximum advantage of the boom to the detriment of building a loyal following are going to be in for a rude awakening someday. But still it is good to hear that at least some of the distilleries take care of their loyal fans and I believe they are frustrated with their inability to make all those people, as well as the newer drinkers (emphasis on drinkers), happy.

[JakeySnakes]

Heading out to the bin. Enjoyable...but for the price I'll probably pick something else up next time.

[dboland]

I really wanted to like this because it is 10 years old and was like $30 but it ended up being used for bourbon-glazed salmon.

[Kepler]

On 2/2/2020 at 2:23 PM, Jazz June said:

I think this is a good thing to keep in mind as every online barrel pick group hypes the hell out of their picks. At least some of this is clearly for the purpose of flipping their bottles for profit.

Thank you for bringing this up. This is important to point out because it's a good service to any local private FB group member (especially to newbies) who may get caught up in the hype. I know my local FB group hypes their picks incessantly and I find it quite disingenuous because they pass off their FB group as doing some kind of public service for the spirits community. I have no evidence they hype for the purpose of personal profit but I know they engage in the secondary market so I figure someone is likely profiting off their group picks.

Edited February 8, 2020 by Kepler

[Kepler]

3 hours ago, dboland said:

I really wanted to like this because it is 10 years old and was like $30 but it ended up being used for bourbon-glazed salmon.

When did you purchase this?

[dboland]

7 minutes ago, Kepler said:

When did you purchase this?

2014. It made a lot of good salmon. The screw cap may have messed with the bottle as I have noticed on some of my older bottle style Wellers.

[Vosgar]

Dessert in a bottle. One of those that was probably better than I deserve  

 

[fishnbowljoe]

20 minutes ago, Vosgar said:

Dessert in a bottle. One of those that was probably better than I deserve  

Is that the River’s Casino bottling?  If so, that was a truly excellent bottle. Thanks for sharing a bit here and there over the years. I almost hate to admit this, but yes, you deserved it Bag. 
 

Biba!  El Doucé

[Bret Bret]

1 hour ago, Vosgar said:

Dessert in a bottle. One of those that was probably better than I deserve  

 

It saddens me that it is empty. It glanddens me that it was enjoyed.

[Kepler]

Finished off the OF rye not long ago. I'm a big fan.

 

[Vosgar]

4 hours ago, fishnbowljoe said:

Is that the River’s Casino bottling?  If so, that was a truly excellent bottle. Thanks for sharing a bit here and there over the years. I almost hate to admit this, but yes, you deserved it Bag. 
 

Biba!  El Doucé

No, not a River's Casino, those are gone . This was a standard release and unfortunately, I don't have any more